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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Alucard_SxE" data-source="post: 20163471" data-attributes="member: 531919">You only seem to understand WHAT YOU WANT TO UNDERSTAND from what I say. .It's not what he says to others that are lies. It's what he says to himself to justify his actions & that he points out those things to others which are lies.It's not about LIES. He doesn't understand what is right or wrong at that time. It's something of an automated lie that comes out of his mouth by his thinking. It's like this. Ok I killed the king. People blame me saying kingslayer. I did stop his plans of the destruction of the kingslanding did I not? So yeah that's why I killed the king.That's what he says to himself and others. The way he tries to justify his actions. We also sometimes do something of a similar but not so serious stuff. Like, I need to study today night for an exam. But it's raining & cold.So I tell myself it's cold & hard. I can cover this up by tomorrow. Can't study in this condition. I'm not studying because of this. I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE THE FACT THAT I'M TOO LAZY AND NOT WANTING TO STUDY BY MAKING EXCUSES.“That boy had wanted to be Ser Arthur Dayne, but someplace along the way he had become the Smiling Knight instead.”– Jaime's thoughts on himself“I have made kings and unmade them. Sansa Stark is my last chance for honor.”- Jaime to Brienne of Tarth"Make a habit of it, Lannister, and one day men might call you Goldenhand after all. Goldenhand the Just.”- thoughts of Jaime after hanging outlaws“Defeated in the Whispering Wood by the Young Wolf Robb Stark during the War of the Five Kings. Held captive at Riverrun and ransomed for a promise unfulfilled. Captured again by the Brave Companions, and maimed at the word of Vargo Hoat their captain, losing his sword hand to the blade of Zollo the Fat. Returned safely to King's Landing by Brienne, the Maid of Tarth.”- Jaime writing of himself in the White BookHis choices made him the person he is today. And he acknowledges the fact that he made some irrational decisions on the way. He thinking of himself in the ways like thins proves that.All you seem to understand and point out and asking is,He lied or not? He lied to others or not? He understand later he lied to others or not?? <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />Those quotes I've stated obviously prove that he understands that he made some mistakes in the past that put a dark mark on him. “That boy had wanted to be Ser Arthur Dayne, but someplace along the way he had become the Smiling Knight instead.”He understands he had become a bad person. That made some bad and harsh decisions without understanding the consequences.“I have made kings and unmade them. Sansa Stark is my last chance for honor.”Making kings and unmaking them is not within his power. In his position he simply cannot make them. He knows this. He know by doing these things he has put a black mark on his name.. And he understand that by doing something like honouring Catelyn's vow will help him regain the honour he lost."Make a habit of it, Lannister, and one day men might call you Goldenhand after all. Goldenhand the Just.”"Just".. It is obvious that he seems to understand and care much about the world, actions & the consequences..What are those deeds that he knows as giving him a black mark, dirtying his honour? If you know the answer for this then you know the answer for your pointless question.I did not fail to produce a single piece of evidence. It is you who don't seem to understand evidence for what it is. You are neglecting everything I say or at least try to find a way past it and ask pointless questions about lies.. You are asking me to point out that he said, "OK I lied"?? <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />Yes. Because his choice to become a knight didn't have dear consequences that led that led to others doubting his actions and later him doubting himself too.There's a whole difference about he wanting to become a knight and then making a serious decision like killing a king and trying to give a reason. It been a long time since I've read the books so yeah there are some thngs I've mistakenly interpreted. But again it doesn't make a difference here.Yes the sack has already started before he killed the king. So people are dying even before he killed Aerys. So did he stop that? YOU ARE HELL-BENT ON POINTING OUT THAT JAIME KILLED AERYS TO STOP THE DESTRUCTION OF THE CITY, YOU DON'T SEEM TO COMPREHEND THAT THE CITY IS ALREADY BEING DESTROYED. INNOCENT LIVES WERE BEING LOST.AND IF THAT BEING SAID THEN TWIN IS ALSO SIMILAR TO AERYS SINCE HE KILLED INNOCENT CIVILIANS AND As PER JAIME'S KNIGHTLY VOWS HE'S OBLIGED TO STOP TYWIN FROM DOING THAT EVEN.  Again.... <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/dull.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":dull:" title="Dull    :dull:" data-shortname=":dull:" />People died in landing. You are making the same excuse as Jaime. "Oh yeah. I killed aryes because he was about to burn everyone."So tywin was killing poeple too. Murdering and raping during the sack.People were dying no matter what. The same people who were going to be burnt were being killed by tywin. So????Dude.. Seriously? So according to you there's a specific time to abandon the Vows?? And you justify this??  <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />Ok. So he can't go to a king's enemy (not his) and discuss with him because he withstand kingsguards' vows but can kill the king?? <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />He obeyed the king within the time he could've done to stop everything but betrayed the king when he couldn't do anything? <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" /> Wha??? I can't even... <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" /> So if guarding the king comes first before family where does protecting the king with his own blood and NOT BETRAYING AND NOT KILLING THE KING comes ??According to you not betraying and keeping the king alive comes after everything after in his vow.. <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />And he could've saved Elia and her children because killing of them came after that by the hands of Gregor & Lorch.He did not want to be in the kingsguard to begin with. He only agreed to that because he wanted to be close to Cersei.. But then he lost that opportunity too. It is said by Jaime in someplace that he only feels alive only when fucking Cersei and Fighting. He loose both of these things when he was with Aerys.He did not simply care about the vows.. He stayed there because he had no choice.Yes he heard what Aerys planned and said. But he only stood and watched. Because he had no choice in the matter.And when the moment came, he snapped. Did an irrational thing. It's more of a defence mechanism. He knows for a fact that he broke the most important vow by killing Aerys and is doomed. So the obvious choice that comes up to him is making himself not be accountable to the murder of Aerys.But then again there could be many more to the way he describes the event.AND unlike in the TV show this event is a dream in the books. As I read somewhere. "This is how Jaime recalls the events in his 2nd ASOS chapter via a dream. The king is alone in the throne room and Jaime steps in wearing his golden armor, with Rossart's blood on his sword. Aerys yells at him to go kill his father and asks whose blood is on Jaime's blade. When Jaime replies "Rossart's" Aerys shits himself and starts running up the IT. At this point Jaime heaves him off the steps and then slashes his throat just as Lord Crakehall and others from his father's army open the doors. They see him killing the King and in his opinion, judge him."NO. Because Aerys was alone and helpless in the throne room.There were so many ways to stop Aerys without killing him.1. When the king asks Jaime, "who's blood is that on your sword?", Jaime says Rossarts'. So if he wanted to stop a person from shouting or crying for help why would he give out another reason to shout and cry out for help?? Or to pass the message as per you?2. Even then after that, Aerys gets super scared and shits himself and what does he do? He crawls up towards the top of the Iron Throne.For your information, this is what the actual throne looks like.<img src="http://www.vanityfair.fr/uploads/images/thumbs/201328/pop_corn_game_of_thrones_trone_big_9422.jpeg_north_300x_transparent.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" />There is no way out of the throne room and there is no way out after climbing the iron throne. There's even the possibility the Aerys could stumble and died by the throne it self... But Jaime, being the person he is, scaled up the iron throne, killed Aerys cold bloodedly.So Aerys had the time to shout out for help or a message after hearing the word "Rossarts".. even if the room was isolated and no escape and no one to hear him, and then he runs up the iron throne, again a dead end.And the Red keep was under Jaime's command. He had so many chances to stop from any bloodshed to further bloodshed from happening. But he didn't think or cared about those opportunities.What is the event of Aerys saying "go ahead with your plan" are you talking about? You mean shouting in a trial? And again the plans were known to a limited number of people. You yourself said that Jaime hunted those people down.Oh and you are saying that Jaime thought of all those events leading to a trial and then Aerys shouting there AND took the decision of killing him?  He thought all those things through  before killing Aerys??And might I add Jaime was something like 17 at that time. He was not experienced or in a state of making rational decisions. Both Tyrion & Barristan make strong claims about that.You state what could've happen (and only in 1:100 odds I might add) if he took the decision of sparing Aerys. And again you tries to explain that Jaime thought all those things through and even the least odds of something like that happening. (Like someone like Sherlock according to you <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/baffled.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":baffled:" title="Baffled    :baffled:" data-shortname=":baffled:" />).But you don't acknowledge what He SHOULD have done at that time.If he had the brains & the ability to make rational choices.You only state what could've happen even if the odds of happening that is quite low.(Ok lets say I do what you do and state what could've happened... A pyromancer could've walked on to Jaime killing rossart and still activate the plan. A pyromancer could've walked in to Jaime killing Aerys and still activate the plan.. And I can give many other reasons too. So do you see the things you are pointing out?? I can point out those things too against you if you want)Because for the simple fact that he did not care about the oaths.He did not want to be in the kingsguard to begin with.He chose to be at king's side because there wasn't any choice other than that at that time.But when he saw the moment of having to get rid of it, he simply chose it. White Bull would've kept his oaths and stay at Kings side. Because he was loyal to the end.And again I have to explain to you that I don't see a hero or a villain in this because there isn't a one. What I state simply is killing Aerys at that moment, with the way things happened, defines him for what he is. Irrational, vile and doesn't care about oaths other that his gains. If you don't understand what gains are let me explain that to you too. Getting rid of his bound to aerys. His anger. Him wanting to be with Cersei. His loyalty to the lannisters. His loyalty to his father..I have to repeat this again. <img src="/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/default/dull.gif"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":dull:" title="Dull    :dull:" data-shortname=":dull:" />I don't mean that disobeying his vows and acting against king's will isn't what he should do at this point. What I'm saying is, his irrational action of killing Aerys cold-bloodedly defines that he did not care about his vows. What about "I simply don't care"??He had so much time from Aerys opening the doors of landing to tywin to killing aerys.. To make so many decisions in favour of seving his kinghtly oaths as you state. But the choice he took was the last one when all was lost and nothing much to happen.This again is Jaime making a excuse of it. I've explained it numerous time before.Robert kept Jaime around because he saw Jaime's actions as Justice. Robert was a great fighter. But then again he was an irrational ruler who couldn't foresee the future. (Couldn't even find out his wife is being fucked by Jaime and that his sons are technically not his. Ser Barristan saw Jaime for what he is and agreed that he doesn't deserve to be in the kingsguard.The kingsguard withheld BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE BARRISTAN. It's his honour that makes him so worthy. Even as an enemy.But still barristan regrets himself for some of the actions he took. Like swearing fealty to robert & then Joffery.</blockquote>

Verification: Hathara warak wissa keeyada? (Hathara wadi karanna 20)

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