Know Islam one question at a time

[diamonddrago]

educating is good. But when performing a surgical procedure dont you think its important to get the informed consent from the patient ???
I suggest that the circumcision age should be at least 10-12 years. Then they can decide by themselves, whether they want this or not. And i dont think 9-10 years old kids are sexually active ( though some were phedophiles )
So they wont have any risk of HIV, or HPV or other STDs.

no no no....dude...your getting it wrong.....circumcision is not compulsory....

my brother in law a muslim is not still circumcised....nor is my nephew....but i think most men from his side of family are circumcised

its called a sunnah (non-compulsory act...that gets you extra points...like good handwriting in exams....).....

i do admit that circumcision was done before by non-practicing medical personnel a few years ago....

but now-a-days...its done by doctors...mostly after birth...AND after the child's parents have discussed with the doctors....

i think i should have cleared this up at the beginning....i tot i did.....

and yeah like you said....asking the consent of the patient is kinda important....but circumcision is best done at young age....i had mine done when i was a baby....which is the majority.....but some do it later too.....

 

[Randir]

give this link a read through.....

http://www.wikiislam.com/wiki/Quran_Explains_The_Human_Body

In arabic calcium is just calcium and bones are "adam" when people learn at school, university dont tell that, calcium = adam..
you don't know arabic, so u dont feel the difference between these 2 words..
religiously imam's can tell adam = calcium, coz bones have calcium.
but its not the correct word.. correct word for bones in arabic is "Adam"

 

[diamonddrago]

In arabic calcium is just calcium and bones are "adam" when people learn at school, university dont tell that, calcium = adam..
you don't know arabic, so u dont feel the difference between these 2 words..
religiously imam's can tell adam = calcium, coz bones have calcium.
but its not the correct word.. correct word for bones in arabic is "Adam"

nope dude...there is a difference between the Arabic which the Quran is written in....and the basic Arabic spoken/used now.....

its like the difference between Shakespearean English and normal English....

go read that link...and you will understand....

 

[Randir]

nope dude...there is a difference between the Arabic which the Quran is written in....and the basic Arabic spoken/used now.....

its like the difference between Shakespearean English and normal English....

go read that link...and you will understand....

thats what I said, imam can tell that, but In normal arabic speaking, bones are not equal to calcium...
so you cant tell that in arabic calcium = bones

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

yes but you have to understand...Islam isn't trying to teach/protect ONLY the upper middle class sri lankans.....or the lowers classes of ppl in Japan...etc.....

its about educating everyone.....each and every single human on earth....

the good the bad...& the ugly.....

EDIT : > thanx for you link dude...its freaking great.....just searched for "circumcision"....it even helps prevent penile cancer....who knew....but i also have to admit there are also concerns with mishap operations...and possible implications to people with anemia....or such diseases.....still.....wow....

read this one that i found....

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20410876

and the CDC from america embracing circumcision....gay men still in trouble.........

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20408390

1.How many of the people you know have penile cancer??? Is it a common deadly disease??
2. Do you know the function of the langerhans cells??? Do you know the importance of them?? They are there to do certain function, by cutting you may partially prevent HIV infection (although it is arguable) but the other functions will be impared too.
Dont you think still condoms/education side favors over circumcision???
3. About the 2nd article, doesn't it say you have to inform about the benefits as well as the risks too

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

no no no....dude...your getting it wrong.....circumcision is not compulsory....

my brother in law a muslim is not still circumcised....nor is my nephew....but i think most men from his side of family are circumcised

its called a sunnah (non-compulsory act...that gets you extra points...like good handwriting in exams....).....

i do admit that circumcision was done before by non-practicing medical personnel a few years ago....

but now-a-days...its done by doctors...mostly after birth...AND after the child's parents have discussed with the doctors....

i think i should have cleared this up at the beginning....i tot i did.....

Did the docs warned you about the potential risks and did you gave them the informed consent, that you are aware of benefits and risks??

 

[diamonddrago]

කෙටියෙන් කියනවානම් "අත්තාහි අත්ථනෝ නාථෝ.."
හැබැයි කොහෙද ඉතින් අර පොතේ නැත්තන් මොකුත් පිලිගන්න උන්යැ..

the Quran has the same type of message too.....

think Buddhism is the best "religion"....

please don't hate me guys...just proving a point....

 

[diamonddrago]

Did the docs warned you about the potential risks and did you gave them the informed consent, that you are aware of benefits and risks??

my parents did.....in my stead.....after going through what the doc said....

 

[diamonddrago]

1.How many of the people you know have penile cancer??? Is it a common deadly disease??
2. Do you know the function of the langerhans cells??? Do you know the importance of them?? They are there to do certain function, by cutting you may partially prevent HIV infection (although it is arguable) but the other functions will be impared too.
Dont you think still condoms/education side favors over circumcision???
3. About the 2nd article, doesn't it say you have to inform about the benefits as well as the risks too

if education alone is enough.....then why does countries that carry sexual education as a normal high school syllabus....

like america....Japan...and even africa....still have cases of HIV....

yeah the langerhans cells is like the only node not attached to the central nervous system....but its a freaking beacon to HIV...
..like some all-you-can-eat-buffet.....coz that is what the langerhans cells does....attracts viruses and other germs to attack it...in place of the body....

but in doing that...it just becomes a cesspool for trouble waiting to happen....and the langerhans cells is the reason HIV is so successful.....

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

my parents did.....in my stead.....after going through what the doc said....

Is it your or your dad's foreskin circumcised?

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

if education alone is enough.....then why does countries that carry sexual education as a normal high school syllabus....

like america....Japan...and even africa....still have cases of HIV....

Isn't sexual education a part of education??
And i think only the geeks would study about reproductive system while others enjoying porn (if it is not compulsory) So i think it is a right choice to teach sexual education in high schools.
Apart from education you should be concerned about your health.

And don't think all the Americans/Japanese are well educated. If you don't concern about your health (even you are well educated about this)you will have a high risk of getting HIV, no matter how many condoms you wear, circumcision or whatever.
So still educating and following most beneficial, least risky procedures are the best option.

 

[diamonddrago]

Is it your or your dad's foreskin circumcised?

as a parent....they have the right to make certain decision for me....due to experience...and the love they have for their child.....

when he brought me my first bike...i didn't ask him if he tot i would die learning to ride etc....doing that is rude....and not to mention a mockery of their love for me....

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

yeah the langerhans cells is like the only node not attached to the central nervous system....but its a freaking beacon to HIV...
..like some all-you-can-eat-buffet.....coz that is what the langerhans cells does....attracts viruses and other germs to attack it...in place of the body....

but in doing that...it just becomes a cesspool for trouble waiting to happen....and the langerhans cells is the reason HIV is so successful.....

You wont get HIV by hanging your penis in the air. You have to do an intercourse with an affected person Why can't you stop that??
& this is not a curative method. its just a prevention method and not 100% successful.
But education, awareness, self control are 100% successful

 

[diamonddrago]

Isn't sexual education a part of education??
And i think only the geeks would study about reproductive system while others enjoying porn (if it is not compulsory) So i think it is a right choice to teach sexual education in high schools.
Apart from education you should be concerned about your health.

And don't think all the Americans/Japanese are well educated. If you don't concern about your health (even you are well educated about this)you will have a high risk of getting HIV, no matter how many condoms you wear, circumcision or whatever.
So still educating and following most beneficial, least risky procedures are the best option.

lol...what are you saying....?!!?

by sexual education i don't mean human biology etc....its sexual education....basically its the govt's idea to try and brainwash children about the dangers of sex....and try to avoid sex....

still in these countries HIV still on the rise....

most ppl know smoking will cause cancer....heck its even printed on the packet...do they stop?....

same thing with HIV.....they know its same...but some ppl won't listen......EVEN if they are educated....its part of human diversity....

by circumcision....they can get a more natural protection...than relying on the ppl themselves to protect themselves....

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

as a parent....they have the right to make certain decision for me....due to experience...and the love they have for their child.....

when he brought me my first bike...i didn't ask him if he tot i would die learning to ride etc....doing that is rude....and not to mention a mockery of their love for me....

Circumcision is not a curative method like vaccinations. Your child wont get HIV even if you dint perform it. Most probably religious beliefs made them to do this Isn't it??

BTW i have seen how muslim parents made decisions for the betterment of their kids lives. All the muslim women i talked in this year dint have their Rubella vacc. and some never heard of it

 

[diamonddrago]

You wont get HIV by hanging your penis in the air. You have to do an intercourse with an affected person Why can't you stop that??
& this is not a curative method. its just a prevention method and not 100% successful.
But education, awareness, self control are 100% successful

they tot the same think when they printed "smoking causes cancer" on cigarette packets...did it stop?....

prevention is better than an ounce of cure yes....

but when it comes to sex....ppl don't think with their heads.....and that is reality....

 

[diamonddrago]

Circumcision is not a curative method like vaccinations. Your child wont get HIV even if you dint perform it. Most probably religious beliefs made them to do this Isn't it??

BTW i have seen how muslim parents made decisions for the betterment of their kids lives. All the muslim women i talked in this year dint have their Rubella vacc. and some never heard of it

it was not only muslim parents....

thank god my dad makes me and my sisters go to the clinic even for just a cold....

and yes circumcision is not a curative...but atleast it offers some protection...where there could be none....

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

lol...what are you saying....?!!?

by sexual education i don't mean human biology etc....its sexual education....basically its the govt's idea to try and brainwash children about the dangers of sex....and try to avoid sex....

still in these countries HIV still on the rise....

most ppl know smoking will cause cancer....heck its even printed on the packet...do they stop?....

same thing with HIV.....they know its same...but some ppl won't listen......EVEN if they are educated....its part of human diversity....

by circumcision....they can get a more natural protection...than relying on the ppl themselves to protect themselves....

Who sed the last line??? fore skin is there for the natural protection.
And for the people who cant control themselves, let them follow protective procedures. Still i prefer condoms

Anyway what will you do if scientists find a cure for HIV ??? will you stop performing it??? or will you continue it as a ritual??

 

[smallvilleclerk50]

it was not only muslim parents....

thank god my dad makes me and my sisters go to the clinic even for just a cold....

and yes circumcision is not a curative...but atleast it offers some protection...where there could be none....

Lucky your sisters but not all the muslim ladies are lucky enough.
Anyways as its not my problem, i wont bother at all.

And safe sex offer more protection than circumcision

 

[diamonddrago]

Who sed the last line??? fore skin is there for the natural protection.
And for the people who cant control themselves, let them follow protective procedures. Still i prefer condoms

Anyway what will you do if scientists find a cure for HIV ??? will you stop performing it??? or will you continue it as a ritual??

its not just about HIV....its about being cleaner as a whole....

uncircumcised penises tend to get alot of dirt...etc stuck under the foreskin....and you have to constantly clean it to stop unnecessary infections...not just HIV....

its a whole lot cleaner to do this as well....so yeah....muslims will always try to circumsize if they can/want to....its just so much better...if done right....