Would u Blow that Boat ? - Dark Knight

kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    Seems you are very familiar with the marvel and DC universes.
    Started with watching Spider man on TV back in the eighties. Anyone remember the toons shown back then ? Also was lucky enough to visit a comics convention a few years back.

    coolioWiZ said:
    I like gray characters . . .coz i feel character development is essential for a good story. I mostly read fantasy and science fiction novels and i like those with a good plot line and believable characters . .some are the 2d good/evil mold . .but there are fantastic works with gray and believeable characters (for eg george r.r. martin's song of ice and fire series)
    +1 for S.F. ! I do like my A.C. Clerk and Asimov but not much in to fantasy stuff unless they contain some explicit sex scenes ;)

    coolioWiZ said:
    In the real world we never get always good or always bad characters . .people just react to the current situation, whether the action is good or evil depends on the intepretation of others around that person.
    Not everyone falls in to that. We do get some pure evil characters. SS's leader Himmler was a truly evil character. PolPot was a truly even character as were Idi Amin. Some of the tiger boys getting their asses kicked up north falls in to this sect as well.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    Started with watching Spider man on TV back in the eighties. Anyone remember the toons shown back then ? Also was lucky enough to visit a comics convention a few years back.

    wow . . .you've got such an experience . . .are u not in lanka . .coz i don't think a comic con will be held in lanka.


    kosandpol said:
    +1 for S.F. ! I do like my A.C. Clerk and Asimov but not much in to fantasy stuff unless they contain some explicit sex scenes ;)
    hehe you can get your fair share of sex in most fantasy novels . . even in grrm's books (remember the characters are gray) . . .hmm i think u should read Kushiel's Dart and the rest in the series by Jacqueline Carey . . .pure dark fantasy with lots of sex(not distasteful but truely to the plot) :) I like Asimov's foundation series . . it was quite a phenomenon according to those days thinking. now what i read on sci fic falls in to the cyberpunk type


    kosandpol said:
    Not everyone falls in to that. We do get some pure evil characters. SS's leader Himmler was a truly evil character. PolPot was a truly even character as were Idi Amin. Some of the tiger boys getting their asses kicked up north falls in to this sect as well.

    LOL they may brand me a kotiya . . . but each and every name u mentioned have their own backstory. I'm not trying to justify their actions . .but any psychosis has it's origin. The existance of these types of characters baffle me. Maybe it's the sense of invincibility they experienced which made them run havoc and oppress the victims.
     

    kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    wow . . .you've got such an experience . . .are u not in lanka . .coz i don't think a comic con will be held in lanka.
    The comic con was not in SL. Like I said, I was lucky to visit that. The toons of the 80s was in SL. The superhero craze was on full time in the mid and late 80s as comics were widely available as well as the superhero swap cards.
    I had the full superhero book filled up with all the hero and villain cards.
    A pack of 5 or 10 cards (cant remember now) was Rs. 5/- and there were several vendors by the school gate then. Those vendors must have made millions out of the school kids. Selling those cards.
    Captain America, Spider Man and a few others were the hardest to find and there were some serious fights when those cards went missing.
    The older 70s to 40s comics were available in the second hand book stores in Maradana. I was always able to sneak a few when my dad use to rent books from them. The shop owner was kind enough to let me have them as long as return them along with dad's books. Needless to say that the 40s books were extremely rare. I was able to find only a handful of those.

    coolioWiZ said:
    hehe you can get your fair share of sex in most fantasy novels . . even in grrm's books (remember the characters are gray) . . .hmm i think u should read Kushiel's Dart and the rest in the series by Jacqueline Carey . . .pure dark fantasy with lots of sex(not distasteful but truely to the plot) :) I like Asimov's foundation series . . it was quite a phenomenon according to those days thinking. now what i read on sci fic falls in to the cyberpunk type
    Asimov's stories were always out of the box. The man was a genius. However I like Clerk's visions of the future though.

    coolioWiZ said:
    LOL they may brand me a kotiya . . . but each and every name u mentioned have their own backstory. I'm not trying to justify their actions . .but any psychosis has it's origin. The existance of these types of characters baffle me. Maybe it's the sense of invincibility they experienced which made them run havoc and oppress the victims.
    They had pleasure in sadistically torturing their victims. I doubt any back story can justify those actions other than being purely evil.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    The comic con was not in SL. Like I said, I was lucky to visit that. The toons of the 80s was in SL. The superhero craze was on full time in the mid and late 80s as comics were widely available as well as the superhero swap cards.
    I had the full superhero book filled up with all the hero and villain cards.
    A pack of 5 or 10 cards (cant remember now) was Rs. 5/- and there were several vendors by the school gate then. Those vendors must have made millions out of the school kids. Selling those cards.
    Captain America, Spider Man and a few others were the hardest to find and there were some serious fights when those cards went missing.
    The older 70s to 40s comics were available in the second hand book stores in Maradana. I was always able to sneak a few when my dad use to rent books from them. The shop owner was kind enough to let me have them as long as return them along with dad's books. Needless to say that the 40s books were extremely rare. I was able to find only a handful of those.

    I was born in 86 . . .so to say i don't have the experiences you've had :( . . . i remember there was a craze for cricket cards in the late 90s ( maybe coz lanka won the world cup) and according to my bro there are packs of pokemon cards at their school gate these days . . lol pokemon is kinda lame in my opinion but i like anime. . .that outside school gate type business is quite a genius business . . .we never expect but maybe even the begger at the temple gate may earn more than your typical office worker :baffled:

    kosandpol said:
    Asimov's stories were always out of the box. The man was a genius. However I like Clerk's visions of the future though.

    I also prefer clarke's vision about the future . . but my mind is now filled with a future world governed by megacorporations while a internet like super entity controls every aspect of daily life . . . there are rebels who try to "hack" or go against that system . . maybe good maybe evil mostly gray (that is the essence of cyberpunk)

    kosandpol said:
    They had pleasure in sadistically torturing their victims. I doubt any back story can justify those actions other than being purely evil.

    ya can't justify their actions . . . atleast they found different ways of executing their victims (nazi = gas chambers, polpot's mass graves = now the sculls are used to build monuments). The autocrities commited can't be justified in any case . . but i feel it's a part of the world . .every thing has it's beginning and end. this is no total utopia :(
     

    sri_lion

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    kosandpol said:
    You're talking about the Batman Beyond : return of the joker movie. That's how the history is shown in that movie. According to that movie. the first Robin (Dick Greyson I think) leaves Batman after that incident.

    Yup! that's the one! which later Terry defeats! he is NOT the usual BAT though! Quite talkative and no problem smiling... very unlike Bruce!:lol:

    But I prefer BRUCE!

    I saw you posted in the earlier post about the "Kryptonite" that he carries in his belt.. and do you remember later he pass it to Terry one fine day... saying.. "Its not the 1st time Superman went MAD" :lol: :lol:
     

    kosandpol

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    sri_lion said:
    Yup! that's the one! which later Terry defeats! he is NOT the usual BAT though! Quite talkative and no problem smiling... very unlike Bruce!:lol:
    In Batman Beyond, the Bat suit is worn by Bruce's nephew or something like that. It takes place in the future where Bruce Wayne has now grown old.
    sri_lion said:
    But I prefer BRUCE!
    +1. There's only 1 Bruce Wayne.

    sri_lion said:
    I saw you posted in the earlier post about the "Kryptonite" that he carries in his belt.. and do you remember later he pass it to Terry one fine day... saying.. "Its not the 1st time Superman went MAD" :lol: :lol:
    I haven't seen that particular episode. I didn't follow Batman Beyond that closely. As for that time Superman went mad, its a reference to the comics as that story arc exists only in the comics. Its an incident were a mind controlling villain (I forgot the name) who works for Darkseid controls his mind

    Speaking of superman, the man of steel is 70 years old this year and he still looks like this :
    trinity01.jpg
     

    kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    and according to my bro there are packs of pokemon cards at their school gate these days . . lol pokemon is kinda lame in my opinion but i like anime. . .
    That's a kids anime. The target audience for that is below 10.

    coolioWiZ said:
    that outside school gate type business is quite a genius business . . .we never expect but maybe even the begger at the temple gate may earn more than your typical office worker :baffled:
    Its a crazy world we live in..

    coolioWiZ said:
    I also prefer clarke's vision about the future . . but my mind is now filled with a future world governed by megacorporations while a internet like super entity controls every aspect of daily life . . . there are rebels who try to "hack" or go against that system . . maybe good maybe evil mostly gray (that is the essence of cyberpunk)
    Ghost in the Shell eh ? I like that anime too but I dont quite see that happening anytime soon unless Clerk's brainman becomes a reality.

    coolioWiZ said:
    ya can't justify their actions . . . atleast they found different ways of executing their victims (nazi = gas chambers, polpot's mass graves = now the sculls are used to build monuments). The autocrities commited can't be justified in any case . . but i feel it's a part of the world . .every thing has it's beginning and end. this is no total utopia :(
    Even without those lunatics, this world is still no utopia. There are enough problems to go around.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    That's a kids anime. The target audience for that is below 10.

    well my bro is beyond 10 but is still interested in these stuff. :) I've played some pokemon games (i'm a fan of rpg games) but got bored after finding that they doesn't have any interesting plot except for capturing pokemon and fighting the guilds. It's quite a lame idea for me . . .maybe coz i'm beyond the age range it's intended for

    kosandpol said:
    Ghost in the Shell eh ? I like that anime too but I dont quite see that happening anytime soon unless Clerk's brainman becomes a reality.
    I was talking about cyberpunk in general . . . you can find more details here
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk
    Neal Stephenson's Diamond Age is a nice one . . one of my fav.

    kosandpol said:
    Even without those lunatics, this world is still no utopia. There are enough problems to go around.
    Ya there are a hell lot . . . degrading traditons, environmental problems and also the rising power of fascism . . .looks like we will have to deal with mushroom clouds again sooner than later :(
     

    kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    well my bro is beyond 10 but is still interested in these stuff. :) I've played some pokemon games (i'm a fan of rpg games) but got bored after finding that they doesn't have any interesting plot except for capturing pokemon and fighting the guilds. It's quite a lame idea for me . . .maybe coz i'm beyond the age range it's intended for
    The 'mon' animes (Pokemon, Doremon, etc) were target for small kids. That's why older crowds find those anime to be lame.
    I watch a fair amount of anime but I'm selective in what I watch.

    coolioWiZ said:
    I was talking about cyberpunk in general . . . you can find more details here
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyberpunk
    Neal Stephenson's Diamond Age is a nice one . . one of my fav.
    It appears that some of my favorite animes belongs to this category :
    Serial Experiment Lain, Texhnolyze, GITS, GITS Second Gig, Bubblegum Crisis .. all of these are Cyberpunk..

    coolioWiZ said:
    Ya there are a hell lot . . . degrading traditons, environmental problems and also the rising power of fascism . . .looks like we will have to deal with mushroom clouds again sooner than later :(
    err.. I don't see people nuking each other just yet, but the other problems certainly are there.
     

    earthling

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    Anybody agree or dissagree with the below review about the joker ?

    and BTW is this movie realy about Batman ? Think its all baout the Joker

    earthling said:
    Much ink has been spilled already over Heath Ledger’s performance as the Joker, so I won’t add anything other than his statuette is already in the post. The Joker is psychotic, or at least he is intended to be. I have never dealt with a schizophrenic who was this well organized, and able to plan out an elaborate chess exchange to rival Anderssen’s ‘Immortal Game’, so the allusion of psychosis is bullshit. In reality he is quite sane, quite suicidal, but above all has come to an understanding about human nature. He commits some impressive homicides, but when his own hand is involved, you can see the boredom in his eyes. He only comes alive when he manipulates people into killing each other, which at times is all too easy. The killing is not a goal in itself, and he certainly is not interested in cash – he wishes to hold a mirror to everyone he sees, and convince the reflection that the better angels of our nature are a fabrication of our ego, the sort of thing to help us sleep at night. The way he sees it, he is only performing a public service, though one from which he derives great joy. In this way, his character resembles the corrupt police chief of Bertrand Tavernier’s Coup de Torchon – the murders are but the manifestations of human desires, and are all too easy to arrange. To thine own self be true, and so forth.

    The Joker steps into a Gotham City on the verge of breaking the mafia with the help of Batman, who has applied a heavy hand to bring order. Disorder always pushes back, however, and the force required to do so unleashes a wave of terror that leaves the citizens, the cops, and the viewer reeling. The Joker has come to the realization that once you have no reason to hold back, anything is possible. With no fear of police, or Batman, or anything else, he can strike hard enough, and fast enough, to bring the panic to a critical mass, and achieve the chaos necessary to reveal true human character. Lock enough rats in a small enough cage, and they will eat one another to remain alive.

    So how does one counter such an onslaught? Conventional police have no purpose here, so Batman must apply extraordinary rendition, torture, massive public surveillance, and war upon the police in order to apply justice. Though his character makes token gestures towards justifying his actions, and the nobility of sacrificing one’s moral code for the greater good, in the end the Joker wins in many different ways. Harvey Dent sings his tune, the people prepare to give in to this terrorist’s demands, and people are driven to commit murder with the greatest haste. Lastly, Batman – thick though he may be on the issue – is coming to realize that the humanity we have so grown to covet is but an artificial construct that we enjoy because it brings us comfort in our elevation above the animals. Deep down we are little more than animals with opposable thumbs (which come in handy with weaponry), and all it takes to reveal that aspect of ourselves is someone with the will to push us to that edge.

    Another interesting parallel in the film is the dichotomy between the Joker and Batman, in that they must both survive or they both shall perish. Someone as dangerous as the Joker requires Batman as a sufficiently dangerous response, and justifies his existence, while Batman is what allowed the Joker to be unleashed in the first place. Without one, the other need not exist. Despite some overtures made by Bruce Wayne’s character toward retirement, he seems way too masochistic to consider quitting. He is clearly enjoying himself, though he lacks the Joker’s smile. (I'm putting this example here - SL gov needs the LTTE (War) to survive & the LTTE needs this gov (The War) to survive as well..dont they ?) The sworn enemies need each other to thrive, continually pushing against each other as they consolidate their power, as any conventional definitions of good and evil are left behind in the sandbox with the rest of the toys.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    The 'mon' animes (Pokemon, Doremon, etc) were target for small kids. That's why older crowds find those anime to be lame.
    I watch a fair amount of anime but I'm selective in what I watch.
    It appears that some of my favorite animes belongs to this category :
    Serial Experiment Lain, Texhnolyze, GITS, GITS Second Gig, Bubblegum Crisis .. all of these are Cyberpunk..

    Ya it's cyberpunk ;) . . . Lain is one of my fav . . . i feel even elfen lied has some cyberpunk characters, but mostly a gothic tale about insanity

    other than that i've been watching naruto, fullmetal and bleach lately . . .I like haruhi too, some ppl may say i'm lame for watching haruhi, but haruhi is my all time fav, not coz of the anime . .but the books.

    kosandpol said:
    err.. I don't see people nuking each other just yet, but the other problems certainly are there.

    I'm worried about the fascism on the rise, it takes only a button press to release a missile, untill all these wmd are neutralized we can't rest assured :( . . i don't feel that a utopic world is possible . .but we should atleast be able to evade the pit falls.
     

    kosandpol

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    earthling said:
    Anybody agree or dissagree with the below review about the joker ?

    and BTW is this movie realy about Batman ? Think its all baout the Joker
    Disagree. That review has been made by someone who has no clue about Batman and the universe where Batman exists.

    This movie was really about the rise and fall of Harvey Dent and how the Bat sacrifices his reputation in order to save Harvey's but The problem is that Heath Ledger stole the show with his performance as the Joker.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    Disagree. That review has been made by someone who has no clue about Batman and the universe where Batman exists.

    This movie was really about the rise and fall of Harvey Dent and how the Bat sacrifices his reputation in order to save Harvey's but The problem is that Heath Ledger stole the show with his performance as the Joker.

    lol has to agree on the matter that Heath Ledger was a great performer. I've not watched batman yet . . but his performance in brokeback mountain impressed me :)
     

    asitha_rules

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    earthling bro ur rite mayn.
    the joker 2 me represents the dark side of the human soul, the 'Id' present in all human beingz. He represents our primal instincts 2 follow our beliefs n create chaos. His representation as a joker is ironic cos the shyt that he represents aint funny. It highlights our inability to recognize the power of our darker side. i havnt watched d movie n i dnt feel lyk analyzin that shit anyways. im sik o fukin english. y u talkin bout this shyt anyways?
     

    asitha_rules

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    kosandpol said:
    Disagree. That review has been made by someone who has no clue about Batman and the universe where Batman exists.

    This movie was really about the rise and fall of Harvey Dent and how the Bat sacrifices his reputation in order to save Harvey's but The problem is that Heath Ledger stole the show with his performance as the Joker.

    bro d ppl here aint tlkin bout how heath ledger portrays the joker or any of that shisz. i wanna tlk bout the underlying motivations of the original comic creator and the director o this film cos comicz aint jokez. theyr pretty serius social commentaries. v actualli did "Spiderman 2" as a related text that v analyzed in skool
    so yeh bro

    :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
     

    kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    Ya it's cyberpunk ;) . . . Lain is one of my fav . . . i feel even elfen lied has some cyberpunk characters, but mostly a gothic tale about insanity
    Elfen is an anime I havent watched. Somehow I never was interested in that.

    coolioWiZ said:
    other than that i've been watching naruto, fullmetal and bleach lately . . .
    These are animes I wouldnt touch with a 20 foot pole.
    Speaking of Naruto, when ever that anime is mentioned, this always comes to my mind :
    http://fc01.deviantart.com/fs4/f/2004/265/e/0/narutard.swf
    (watch this to the very end. Even the end of the credits)

    coolioWiZ said:
    I like haruhi too, some ppl may say i'm lame for watching haruhi, but haruhi is my all time fav, not coz of the anime . .but the books.
    Havent seen this at all. Got a review link for it ?

    coolioWiZ said:
    I'm worried about the fascism on the rise, it takes only a button press to release a missile, untill all these wmd are neutralized we can't rest assured :( . . i don't feel that a utopic world is possible . .but we should atleast be able to evade the pit falls.
    Well, at the last check, the US forces are still dusting Iraq for those WMD that was supposed to be there..
     

    kosandpol

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    asitha_rules said:
    bro d ppl here aint tlkin bout how heath ledger portrays the joker or any of that shisz. i wanna tlk bout the underlying motivations of the original comic creator and the director o this film cos comicz aint jokez. theyr pretty serius social commentaries. v actualli did "Spiderman 2" as a related text that v analyzed in skool
    so yeh bro

    :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:

    Err.. I cant understand what you're saying there. Are you agreeing with what I said or disagreeing with what I said ?
     

    coolioWiZ

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    asitha_rules said:
    bro d ppl here aint tlkin bout how heath ledger portrays the joker or any of that shisz. i wanna tlk bout the underlying motivations of the original comic creator and the director o this film cos comicz aint jokez. theyr pretty serius social commentaries. v actualli did "Spiderman 2" as a related text that v analyzed in skool
    so yeh bro

    :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:


    Just my opinion . . when a creation is made the authors are confined to a certain genre . . same way the comic medium itself is quite 2d compared to novels. getting into the base of the intentions of the comic artists i think they wanted a change from the way superhero comics were headed. I've not tried analysing comics before so i'll focus on the state of human mind which the artists explore.

    The joker is a pretty interesting character coz he is portrayed as a coldblooded creature, a raving lunatic with no emotions. But there is another side of the joker when he interacts with harleyquinn . . here we see a dark sort of understanding between the two (some might intepret this as love)

    taking this portrayal to the real world, brings doubts of the state of mind. Can a person be truely evil (which i think is not possible) as i've said before there is a backstory for everything, a reason. (not justifying their actions but for every thing there is a beginning) as i've said before a human mind can divert from it's normal state when certain factors are present. (think of a one who is raped as a child goes on to become a pedophile) also when u feel invincible you tend to do some things you will never do (eg: politicans go corrupt as their power rise) same way a dictator is an exsistance which is bought by the society itself (remember hitler was elected to office).
    My conclusion is that external factors keep a person in check . . the dark state (where u feel u are the one, invincible and suppressed by nobody) will be activated if chance presence it self. humans are obligate parasites.
     

    coolioWiZ

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    kosandpol said:
    Elfen is an anime I havent watched. Somehow I never was interested in that.
    elfen lied ranks high among the anime i've liked. . . . i'm much into gothic stuff and fantasy so it appeals me :)

    kosandpol said:
    These are animes I wouldnt touch with a 20 foot pole.
    Speaking of Naruto, when ever that anime is mentioned, this always comes to my mind :
    http://fc01.deviantart.com/fs4/f/2004/265/e/0/narutard.swf
    (watch this to the very end. Even the end of the credits)

    hehe i know i'll not get any positive for watching stuff like this, but actually this is what i watch.


    kosandpol said:
    Havent seen this at all. Got a review link for it ?


    If u want my take it's about a girl who has god like powers(a pretty oppressive and outrageous character) and her rag tag band. (she thinks these are pretty normal ppl . . but one is a physic one a timetraveller and another is an alien . . these stupid japanese) it's an ongoing story and the first few books have come to anime . . heard season two will be here soon.

    wiki is the best place i can direct u to:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haruhi_Suzumiya_(franchise)

    The books are in japanese . . translated to chinese . .but no official english translation . . u can get a fan translation of all books published so far here:
    http://www.baka-tsuki.net/project/index.php?title=Suzumiya_Haruhi


    I actually curse my self for watching and being a fan of this stuff (i even had haruhi as a sig one time) but don't know how to explain my motivation to read and watch it. I need to be shot. :baffled:

    kosandpol said:
    Well, at the last check, the US forces are still dusting Iraq for those WMD that was supposed to be there..
    :rofl: the current us administration will be gone soon . . and the coming one can continue to police the world. I'd rather prefer US policing the world than it being ruled by a mega corporation looking for profit :yes:
     

    kosandpol

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    coolioWiZ said:
    If u want my take it's about a girl who has god like powers(a pretty oppressive and outrageous character) and her rag tag band. (she thinks these are pretty normal ppl . . but one is a physic one a timetraveller and another is an alien . . these stupid japanese) it's an ongoing story and the first few books have come to anime . . heard season two will be here soon.

    wiki is the best place i can direct u to:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haruhi_Suzumiya_(franchise)

    The books are in japanese . . translated to chinese . .but no official english translation . . u can get a fan translation of all books published so far here:
    http://www.baka-tsuki.net/project/index.php?title=Suzumiya_Haruhi
    Sounds interesting. Thanks for the links

    coolioWiZ said:
    I actually curse my self for watching and being a fan of this stuff (i even had haruhi as a sig one time) but don't know how to explain my motivation to read and watch it. I need to be shot. :baffled:
    Its not that bad. I like stuff like Ai Yori Aoshi and A Y A Enishi, Kare Kano (love this!) Azumanga Daioh. :baffled:

    coolioWiZ said:
    :rofl: the current us administration will be gone soon . . and the coming one can continue to police the world. I'd rather prefer US policing the world than it being ruled by a mega corporation looking for profit :yes:
    What ? US isnt the biggest corporation looking for profit ? :shocked: