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Overclocking Guide
- Thread starter chanster
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zCexVe said:
First of all Yes OB sound is reasonably ok these days.......But u cant compare them to after market cards.....
what makes a soundcard so different from onboard?
a soundcard is a DAC (Digital to Analog Converter), its task is to convert digital data from media source (such as CD, MP3, FLAC, APE, etc etc) into analog signal to be later converted into sound by a speaker.
while onboard and add-on soundcard has similar task, those soundcards have different ways and tools to convert those data into signal.
and while onboard depends on CPU and RAM to process those, an add-on soundcard has its own processor and ram to do that.
if we're talking about greatness of those CPU and RAM, of course technically a core2duo or core2quad is greater, but please do keep in mind that those processor need to process other tasks than just an audio....
in gaming a CPU and RAM on PC has to manage perform tasks from the game software to produce complicated and stressful calculations and graphics.
while on the other hand, using a dedicated soundcard will release the burden of those tasks from your CPU and RAM and not to mention those add-on soundcard has above normal priority set for doing audio processing.
so by having add-on soundcards, at least there will be no more choppy and screechy or any other distracting/interfering sound
now we move on to sound quality.
ever wonder what makes audiophile CD player is so damn expensive(such as Denon CD Player)?
basically a CD player is a DAC (or soundcard itself) becos its task is to read from digital data(CD) and convert it to analog signal through RCA cables (Red and White plug cables)
those expensive CD Player has top notch components such as audio grade capacitors, Operational Amplifiers, and DAC Chip, so there for they produce far superior sound quality compared to other CD/DVD player you can find on the market(toshiba/or any other china brand)
you could test it yourself using the same speaker and you will notice it immediately.
now a soundcard is just the same as those audiophile CD Player minus the CD reader.
it processes those audio task dedicatedly, and using components made solely for that purpose.
this is not a snake oil, if you can demo/hear it for yourself, you should pinpoint the exact difference between generic DAC such as onboard soundcard which depends heavily on PC CPU/RAM with a great dedicated DAC soundcard.
Oh u might want 2 take a look @ this thread as well
My thread and after hours of discussions with da PC Pro's here is decided maybe i should not OC...
And machan da MB software u posted (or someone else) does not hav my MB in it...
My MB is an Asus P4V8X-MX
My thread and after hours of discussions with da PC Pro's here is decided maybe i should not OC...
And machan da MB software u posted (or someone else) does not hav my MB in it...
My MB is an Asus P4V8X-MX
Ranhiru said:Oh u might want 2 take a look @ this thread as well
My thread and after hours of discussions with da PC Pro's here is decided maybe i should not OC...
And machan da MB software u posted (or someone else) does not hav my MB in it...
My MB is an Asus P4V8X-MX
Macho for Asus there is a thing called Asus probe.......which monitors everything...It comes with the mobo CD......
Great to be home.I'm late I suppose .No ones onlinechanster said:
I dont know what you smile at.Those are the things from the past which I learnt on.
And my saying goes on.If you dont have something great speakers you wont feel any.Actually many people cant Identify the slight differences off the sound.And if you look back for the past 3-4 years from AC97 audio to HD audio OB sound has improved in quality a lot.Virtually its the same quality but the few things like CPU usage are different considering the OB and separate card.
zCexVe said:Great to be home.I'm late I suppose .No ones online
I dont know what you smile at.Those are the things from the past which I learnt on.
You tell the same thing on and on and on....... , thanks to your copy and paste techniques
Shall we stop the fight now , this is not good and Im sure that chanster wont be greedy to give you the win !
@ Chanster.Here is your reply
I'll qoute part by part.We are going talking mainly on X-Fis as agreed and mentioning others.
Can you explain this.
The CS4382 8 channel DAC on X Fi Fatality.(It took for years to get the image toshow.)
You can see there is a Cirrus Logic DAC in X-Fi.Well you are the one who wanted to talk about X-Fi.Explain why there is a CA20k1 when DAC is there?
Its the APU is changed.
CA 20K1 (The Audio Processing Unit in X-Fi)is 10000 MIPS while Intel PIV 3.2 GHZ does only 9750 MIPS.
In every aspect C2D/C2Q is great.
Mainly they were built for other tasks but they do AP as a help.
Graphics will be mainly managed by GPU.
My CPU is on pills now coz of Audio Processing stress coz I listen to audio everytime. Jk ok? I had a great day.(If not this)
Usually on nForce4chipsets/Geforce VGAs X-Fi had probs.Screechy/noisy.And some old PIV HT based CPU had the prob.OCing CPU made it correct.And If the PCI bus is overloaded any Separate sound card will have some hitches too.But I accept that there are less hitches by separate cards.
For your info.
The Cirrus Logic DAC directs the audio decoding to CPU while it is not under load to keep the CA20K1 cooler.It gets really hotter.So virtually when you use a Quad it will be always something Audio in Quad.
Speaking of sound quality there are lots of software and hardware things used by different manufacturers.I know like 0.1% of them.Also I do use Wireless headphones and dont have any speakers sh*t is better than audio what I am hearing.So my ears are not the best in audio quality.
The following link is to Creative 24bit crystalyzer.It says it enhances audio,Loads of doubts.Can be sen in chans X-Fi.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/multimedia/creative-x-fi-part2.html
CMSS 3D
Virtual surround from Creative
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=177&type=expert&pid=6
EAX( <3 )
1,2,3,4,5.Latest is 5.0
http://soundblaster.com/eax/abouteax/
Back to topic
You wont feel advertised as much.
Here is an example.My close friend have a 3500 RS. Logitech earphones which has its jack and cable plated in 18 carat gold.Yes,the gold you wear.To ruduce the static and give you a better quality.He got it for the iPod.(He knows quality.When Using a 400RMS Onkyo Japan AMP and a Bose 4.1 ,quality is maxed out).Now still he uses the ones came with iPod for everything.Rarely use that logitech one too. Need I say more?
I'm saying it again,Considering the audio quality with new ones,even if you have Carson Wega,Blaupunkt,Bose,Harmon Kardon,Altec Lansing,Behringer,Infineon,creative,Logitech,JBL,Denon you name it ,It will have small sounds you cant exactly feel and be more sound(Considering X-Fi can produce 172 hardware sound lines).Like 4~5% MORE.(I told ya,I dont feel good in hearing).But it is so not great as advertised.Besides when you listen to 128 kBps CD audio,what quality do you expect?You will get the better quality created by the speakers + the more clear voice and more sounds which depends on the speakers too.
But with the addons like almost dieing EAX,CMSS 3D I accept you cant beat a normal onboard.
It is a long post.So boring.Like working for creative.
Edit:I sign a peace agreement.One way or two way.Tomorrow is a fight holiday.
I'll qoute part by part.We are going talking mainly on X-Fis as agreed and mentioning others.
Its really good.You wont feel a change with my OB Creative SB Audigy 2 SE and chans X-FI coz all the sound is same from these SB audigy and X-Fi. Its the APU is different.And performance wise.Dont think that it will gain 5FPS.But 1-2 may be.
OB one you cant see or separated coz its on your mobo.Separate one can is an addon card .you can remove it
I have nothing to tell
Can you explain this.
The CS4382 8 channel DAC on X Fi Fatality.(It took for years to get the image toshow.
)You can see there is a Cirrus Logic DAC in X-Fi.Well you are the one who wanted to talk about X-Fi.Explain why there is a CA20k1 when DAC is there?
Basically the same.Map the wavetable. use the DAC. etc
Its the APU is changed.He pointed out CA 20k1 APU in Creative X-Fi and Auzen X-Fi Prelude.The APU is like a first came Intel P IV CPU.Handles more than that.
CA 20K1 (The Audio Processing Unit in X-Fi)is 10000 MIPS while Intel PIV 3.2 GHZ does only 9750 MIPS.
OMG.Buddy you would have paid lot bad If i was not in a funny mood.if we're talking about greatness of those CPU and RAM, of course technically a core2duo or core2quad is greater, but please do keep in mind that those processor need to process other tasks than just an audio....
in gaming a CPU and RAM on PC has to manage perform tasks from the game software to produce complicated and stressful calculations and graphics.
while on the other hand, using a dedicated soundcard will release the burden of those tasks from your CPU and RAM and not to mention those add-on soundcard has above normal priority set for doing audio processing.
so by having add-on soundcards, at least there will be no more choppy and screechy or any other distracting/interfering sound
In every aspect C2D/C2Q is great.
Mainly they were built for other tasks but they do AP as a help.
Graphics will be mainly managed by GPU.
My CPU is on pills now coz of Audio Processing stress coz I listen to audio everytime.
Jk ok? I had a great day.(If not this)Usually on nForce4chipsets/Geforce VGAs X-Fi had probs.Screechy/noisy.And some old PIV HT based CPU had the prob.OCing CPU made it correct.And If the PCI bus is overloaded any Separate sound card will have some hitches too.But I accept that there are less hitches by separate cards.
For your info.
The Cirrus Logic DAC directs the audio decoding to CPU while it is not under load to keep the CA20K1 cooler.It gets really hotter.So virtually when you use a Quad it will be always something Audio in Quad.
For the audience
Speaking of sound quality there are lots of software and hardware things used by different manufacturers.I know like 0.1% of them.Also I do use Wireless headphones and dont have any speakers sh*t is better than audio what I am hearing.So my ears are not the best in audio quality.
The following link is to Creative 24bit crystalyzer.It says it enhances audio,Loads of doubts.Can be sen in chans X-Fi.
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/multimedia/creative-x-fi-part2.html
CMSS 3D
Virtual surround from Creative
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=177&type=expert&pid=6
EAX( <3 )
1,2,3,4,5.Latest is 5.0
http://soundblaster.com/eax/abouteax/
Back to topic
You wont feel advertised as much.
Here is an example.My close friend have a 3500 RS. Logitech earphones which has its jack and cable plated in 18 carat gold.Yes,the gold you wear.To ruduce the static and give you a better quality.He got it for the iPod.(He knows quality.When Using a 400RMS Onkyo Japan AMP and a Bose 4.1 ,quality is maxed out).Now still he uses the ones came with iPod for everything.Rarely use that logitech one too.
Need I say more?I'm saying it again,Considering the audio quality with new ones,even if you have Carson Wega,Blaupunkt,Bose,Harmon Kardon,Altec Lansing,Behringer,Infineon,creative,Logitech,JBL,Denon you name it ,It will have small sounds you cant exactly feel and be more sound(Considering X-Fi can produce 172 hardware sound lines).Like 4~5% MORE.(I told ya,I dont feel good in hearing
).But it is so not great as advertised.Besides when you listen to 128 kBps CD audio,what quality do you expect?You will get the better quality created by the speakers + the more clear voice and more sounds which depends on the speakers too.But with the addons like almost dieing EAX,CMSS 3D I accept you cant beat a normal onboard.
It is a long post.So boring.Like working for creative.
Edit:I sign a peace agreement.One way or two way.Tomorrow is a fight holiday.
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This is about X RAM.I totally forgot it.btarunrs article below is a great one about X-RAM.
Edit: better post the link.
http://btarunr-gd.blogspot.com/2007/09/what-2-mib-sdram-bank-on-x-fi-xtreme.html
Edit: better post the link.
http://btarunr-gd.blogspot.com/2007/09/what-2-mib-sdram-bank-on-x-fi-xtreme.html
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Booruvo,Pennapiya puluvan nam same de???Nikan Keyboard ekai tharahai thivuna paliyata type karanava.Sasika@Elakiri said:
Uba ipadune pokunakada ban?Hama ekatama paninne?Danna magulakuth ne.Copy paste gana kiyavanava.Puluvan nam mage post copy karapu thanak me universe eken hoyagena vara.Konda pana ne yako ubalata
Enavanan knowledge ekath ekka varen.Copy paste karapuva mama methana eli karanava mage dialup bila neth nam.Mama ubata warning eka dunna nathi eka,CROSS ME , ITS WAR.You looked good yesterday,I thought wrong.That will never happen.Uba dannava nam OC gena,Sound gena varen .Ube yaluvath ekka set vela onnam copy karagena mata kiyavapan.Mata kisi gamak ne.Mama ubata kivva kelinma mama copy paste karana than.Mama nodanna de,danna de pili gannava.Issellama eka purudu veyan.MAta ubalata vage prasiddiye kunuharpa gahala vedi puruddak ne.Onnam IM add karannam kiyavapan balanna danna deyak gena.
Danaganin uba kochchara kivvath ,mama newsme forum ekata copy->paste karana eka navaththanne ne mata karanna puluvan thak kal.Lagadima beri vevi.Eth ethakan mama vedagath de news and discussion ekata danava.Puluvan nam mata nobena kata hari udavvak vena vedakata post daapan.Aparaade mage post ekai davasai.Kalakanniya
Edit:mama ban vena nisa meka edit kala.next time balamu
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zCexVe said:
Short simple answer im a musician you are a technicle mumbo jumbo.....2 different ppl......As some members said in this forum wut you do is basically copy/paste from the internet.....nothing to do with your knowledge or your taste.....Wait ill get to your other question....
zCexVe said:This is about X RAM.I totally forgot it.btarunrs article below is a great one about X-RAM.
Edit: better post the link.
http://btarunr-gd.blogspot.com/2007/09/what-2-mib-sdram-bank-on-x-fi-xtreme.html
You expect me to believe some blog review???? Its as good as any C-net review....
chanster said:
zCexVe said:
As you say Audigy and X-Fi sound the same is it?? Looking at only the specs the X-Fi blows the Audigy in to bits........Dont speak of things which you are not even sure of....Since you know the specs,ill talk about the practical side....
The biggest sole problem with onboard is noise introduced into the audio - not that it's specs are bad. A dedicated sound card helps isolate your audio processing from the rest of the system (by a minimal degree, though it makes a large difference). I'm sure many of you are probably familiar with "mouse noise" - moving the mouse causing the I/O system to make an annoying buzz/chirp in your sound.
The quality of the good X-Fi sound cards is quite apparent over other sound cards and especially integrated audio. You will hear things in games that you never noticed before, and the clarity and quality of the audio is much better. I went from the [once Creative Labs flagship] Audigy 2 ZS Platinum to the X-Fi Platinum , and noticed the difference right away.
Before bashing a product which you don't even have.....Hear and Believe as creative say
ill leave this as it is...There is a saying..."Never argue with an Idiot"OB one you cant see or separated coz its on your mobo.Separate one can is an addon card .you can remove it
I have nothing to tell
Can you explain this.
The CS4382 8 channel DAC on X Fi Fatality.(It took for years to get the image toshow.
You can see there is a Cirrus Logic DAC in X-Fi.Well you are the one who wanted to talk about X-Fi.Explain why there is a CA20k1 when DAC is there?
Umbata molayak kiyala namayak nadda? What is CA20k1 What is DAC?
CA20k1=It is a DSP....in other words a processor......
DAC=Digital to analog converter which is used for output.......There also is as a Wolfson WM8775 ADC for input........
There are 2 different things.....You know a lot about vga cards......to get something on to the monitor will only the GPU help? NO...it has to go through a DAC!
Yes you maybe correct about the P1V APU part as i do not speak of things which im not sure of...MIPS is only one benchmark. Audio processing is relatively simple and doesn't require path prediction.He pointed out CA 20k1 APU in Creative X-Fi and Auzen X-Fi Prelude.The APU is like a first came Intel P IV CPU.Handles more than that.
CA 20K1 (The Audio Processing Unit in X-Fi)is 10000 MIPS while Intel PIV 3.2 GHZ does only 9750 MIPS.
In every aspect C2D/C2Q is great.
Mainly they were built for other tasks but they do AP as a help.
Graphics will be mainly managed by GPU.
My CPU is on pills now coz of Audio Processing stress coz I listen to audio everytime.
Usually on nForce4chipsets/Geforce VGAs X-Fi had probs.Screechy/noisy.And some old PIV HT based CPU had the prob.OCing CPU made it correct.And If the PCI bus is overloaded any Separate sound card will have some hitches too.But I accept that there are less hitches by separate cards.
Seems that u agree with what i say indirectly......
On the X-Fi? I doubt it but don't know for sure. First, how hot would a DAC really get? Is it worth saving a few degrees to transport digital data to PCI bus, thought the PCI controller, to main memory, to CPU, convert to analogue, back to main memory, back to bus?
Good Sir...I post according to my experience.. please do not fall for those corporate reviews...please refrain yourself of stating numbers in tests....
this is audio... you cannot measure audio with numbers....
and if you do like to read reviews.... try looking for review that aren't from PC hardware site....
testing audio with PC g33ks is like taking your car to a carpenter for engine repair.
Finally you are not experiencing a true Audigy.......The sound card you have Audigy 2 SE is similar to a Audigy value/SE or Xtreme Audio.......which does not have a hardware DSP as part of the audio chip....It loads the processing on the Hosts CPU....So that kind of audio card is basically a onboard with reduced noise.......If you were talking about a real 2001 Audigy or 2002 Audigy 2 then you will see a significant improvement on sound.......Or you are more than welcome to come to my house and experience X-Fi with my cheapo M5300 speakers......
So please without saying X-Fi is not worth when you don't even own one and the fact that you don't have a proper sound card.......don't give our people the wrong information.......
Click My Siggy........(X-Fi related questions)
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zCexVe said:
To your ears maybe.....Im an audiophile......OB sound just cant come close to After market.......
When i was small i had some Rage 3D vga n midtown madness was a very popular game.....It was my first PC so i didnt know anything ...i was just playing and one day i wanted to mess with the graphic options...It was running on "Software rendering" Im not sure but it means rendering through the CPU.....then i switched it to hardware rendering and the result was huge....The quality was a lot better than software rendering......
Using onboard sound is software based...Using dedicated is hardware based.....
So machan just like the GPU will do a better job than the CPU.....The APU also does a better job than the CPU.....Just that Easy to fool the eyes and Hard to fool the ears...
And have to have a decent set of speakers......
Wont believe me.....Come to my place and ill show you...Ill play a song with my realtek and my X-Fi........
EDIT=At that time also i had a separate ESS audio card which sounded far better than the onboard........
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zCexVe said:You are better than sasika@Elakiri but buddy I have some little things to show you.No worries.I make mistakes too.I didnt born with these things,I learnt everything by reading a lot and experimenting.
My post is here because weve had longer covos in 4Q 2006 and first half of 2007 with OCing.You might not have seen them.(coz of EK style,I cant point out a thread,all mixed like achcharu
I use a bloody old AMD RIG,you point out the fact that AMD is harder to OC coz HT decides both CPU frequency and mem clock.But remeber Always the higher clock doesnt do the trick.You should have a good memory bandwidth with a good FSB/HT:Memory ratio.If not it will not be useful.Just to submit the best clock to hwbot.org.
You dont need a gazillion dollars to buy RAM.My OCZ SLi ready 2x2GB DDR800 4-5-4-12 kit costed 160 USD.Considering it does 800~1200 on 4-5-4-12 Its dirty cheap and I bought them last year.Now its more cheap.DDR2 is like cheap whore.Everywhere.
E6600 on air will do more than 4 gig on air @least on my Striker Extreme.I can show you some results with P35s.
This is wrong if its 800 MHz,as Intel is Quad pumped it will be 9x200=1600 MHz
you are telling us about a 1600FSB which will be 400 base and the clock will be 9x400=2600MHz
And just for the record
E6600 stock is 9*266=2400MHz
E6420 stock is 8*266=2130MHz
You can keep the memory around 800 MHz with a mutiplier you have given with the mobo,higher the merrier.
With E2XXX series I totally agree with you.Infact you can mod the CPU to get it as a 1066FSB CPU by default by shorting two notches and it will make it easy.Cache is not sooo much important as ppl say.It will make 1~3 second impact in many cases which in real world usually dont count.
Havent I told the same about onboard VGA?Thats the point.When 95%< ppl use OB VGA how could they OC?I OCed with a 6.5k Asrock conroe 1333 or sumthing with a E4400(10*200)went to like I think 2.4.But memory held it up and had some FSB holes also with OB VGA.So you can see I just have put the 200 to 233 the base clock.The easiest OCs.Like C2Q6600 goes 3gig with 9*333 instead of 9*266.
Nice talking with you.Long time I had a chat like this in EK.The VGA Fanboysm is too much as always and everything ends up either ATi or nVIDIA.
well well look whos talking, the facts are:
* Core 2 CPUs are not made to go beyond 3.2 GHZ (over this limit it will reduce the life span of the CPU by electron leaking in transister levels)
* 160 bucks is a lot u can buy a Radeon 3850 with that kinda money (the best card for that money range) and it will make ur games run faster
* i was not wrong here : "E 6600 mul 9 OC on a 800MHz = 9x400 = 3.6 GHz (almost the limit of a air cooled Core 2 with a G2 revision G0 go a bit higher)
E 6420 mul 8 OC on a 800MHz = 8x400 (corrected from 333) = ~3.0GHz"
u simply confused the 800MHz (what i meant was the speed of the RAM not the FSB) as the FSB, yes i know its quad pumped, thats why i said 9*400(1600/4 = 400
1:1 ratio with the DDR2 ram as u know DDR2 is double pumped means its base freq is 400MHz) and in case u dont know how to multiply 9*400 = 3600 Mathematicaly prooven 4009 *0 = 0
9*0 = 0
9*4 = 36
------------
3600
========
"And just for the record
E6600 stock is 9*266=2400MHz
E6420 stock is 8*266=2130MHz"
and ur point would be what ???
i was not talking about the stock speeds of these CPU's
anyway sorry for the late reply
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