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Questions for Thiests
- Thread starter AncientGlory
- Start date
See, you see things how things in outer world come to an exist, So you come to a conclusion that everything should have a creator. But that theory is not valid for your god hah... Then who created God? You will say he is almighty and he always existed. But how can god exist always and he has no creator but this world has a creator. Why cant it be that world existed always and it continues it self in a cyclic way. You cant find a beginning in a cyclic reaction....
look at the topic dude....
You dont know the meaning of God.God cant be created by someone, then he is not God at all.if someone say u Mr. John gave birth to a baby, u cant ask him that his baby was boy or girl? coz Mr.John can never give birth as he is a male and his attributes are different.
The universe absolutely must have a beginning, so this is not an issue. I will show you why:
Premise a - We exist here today.
Premise b - Before we existed there were a series of events, one after another, leading up to our existence today. (The passing of such a series of events is what we call time, and measure in minutes, days, weeks and years.)
If one accepts premise a, then one must also accept that the series of events in premise b must have a beginning. This must be, because if someone claims that an infinite succession of events had to be concluded before his existence, then he is saying that that infinite succession of events came to an end, which is a contradiction in terms. It is like if someone said “this car will only get to its destination after its wheels have spun infinitely many times,” and then claimed that the car arrived at its destination. It is clear, however, that the car could never have gotten to its destination if an infinite number of spins was the condition for its arrival.
Those who claim that the world has no beginning are in fact saying that it is a prerequisite for tomorrow to arrive that an infinite number of events first take place. This is impossible, because infinity cannot end. Clearly then, the number of events that precedes our existence must have a limit.
In addition, since it is necessarily true that this series of events has a beginning, then it must also be that before this beginning there were no series of events (defined as anything with a beginning). If someone claimed otherwise, then they would end up with the same contradiction (saying that infinity came to an end). Accordingly, the claim that the world was created by random events is irrational.
Rather, there must be a Creator that gave the series of events existence - since it was nonexistent before it began. Moreover, since it is impossible for there to be any events before the existence of this series, then it must also be that the Creator is not attributed with events, i.e. with any attribute or action that has a beginning. This again means that the Creator does not resemble His creation, since all created attributes must have a beginning. Actually, having a beginning and being a creation is the same thing. This is because to create is to bring into existence, and everything with a beginning must have been brought into existence.
We know from the above, by mathematical precision and logical necessity, that the Creator exists and does not resemble His creation. From the fact that the world has a beginning, we have proven that it must have a creator. The name of this creator is Allah in Arabic. If someone asks, “Who created Allah?” we say Allah does not have a creator, and does not need one as He has no beginning. If someone then asks, “how can you accept that Allah has no beginning, while you do not accept that the world has no beginning?” The answer is that we have shown that the world has a beginning based on the fact that it changes (changes are events). We do not believe, however, that Allah changes. Rather, we believe He is One, and doesn’t change and has no beginning.
From all this we can also safely conclude that Allah has a will to specify events, and unlimited power to create them. We can also conclude that He must have knowledge, because specification without knowledge is impossible. It is now easy to see also, that no event can take place without Him willing it. This again means that there is no such thing as real cause, in the sense of one event truly influencing or shaping a subsequent event. There is only correlation, because if an event happens, it’s form can only be completely subjugated to Allah’s Will and Power. All of this is according to the teachings of Islam, as is shown by the following statements in the Quran:
“هُوَ الأَوَّلُ”
“He is Al-Awwal.” (Al-Hadiid, 03).”
If translated literally, it would be “He is the First,” i.e. He existed before everything else, and He was not preceded by non-existence or the existence of something else. It is a beginning-less and necessary existence, and is not affected by anything, since it is not preceded by anything.
“إِنَّ اللَّهَ عَلَى كُلِّ شَيْءٍ قَدِيرٌ”,
Meaning: “Verily Allah is able to create anything.” (Al-Baqarah, 20)
“وَخَلَقَ كُلَّ شَيْءٍ وَهُوَ بِكُلِّ شَيْءٍ عَلِيمٌ”
Meaning: “Allah created everything, and He knows everything.” (Al-’Anˆaam, 101)
“وَخَلَقَ كُلَّ شَيْءٍ فَقَدَّرَهُ تَقْدِيرًا”
Meaning: “And He created everything and predestined it.” (Al-Furqaan, 2)
Based on the above, we can say that if the pattern of quarks truly have no observable correlating event that makes it predictable, and is thus labeled “random,” it is either because Allah has not willed for it to have a correlating event, or because He has not willed for it to be discovered.
No worries AncientGlory, I'm not at all offended by your post. I truly do respect other people's belief.
From your previous post reply to my own post, suggests to me that you find what I'm saying is illogical. No worries either. Let me tell you that I am not trying to convince you that God exists. The first post of this thread you asked how do I know God is there. I was only responding to the question..
You have said that my responses still falls into the 3 categories of your first post. To be quite honest, there seems to me to be only two ways to go, either by faith and or by science. I guess science does not point you to the existence of God, but to me it does.
If you'd like to see some of the science that points me to Him, you can refer to the following link. http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html
Faith, if it wasn't for that, I'd say I've been one too many times lucky in my lifetime. Entering my home only to find robbers, getting into car accidents...since I do not believe in luck, I am convicted that it was God protecting me in these situations. So yes, my belief in the existence of God is based on my faith in Him and the universe that I believe He created also points to Him.
As for whom I believe is God, God is Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ is love and love is Him. I believe before all things He was, He is and He will continue to be. He has no beginning, no end. He created all things, and without Him nothing was created. This is my faith, to be quite frank my faith not only brings me peace of mind, but it helps me sleep at night without wondering what's going to happen in the end of time. If your angle brings you comfort as well, then that's good for you.
Thanks AncientGlory, I do appreciate your respectful and uncalculating responses.
Have a good one.
From your previous post reply to my own post, suggests to me that you find what I'm saying is illogical. No worries either. Let me tell you that I am not trying to convince you that God exists. The first post of this thread you asked how do I know God is there. I was only responding to the question..
You have said that my responses still falls into the 3 categories of your first post. To be quite honest, there seems to me to be only two ways to go, either by faith and or by science. I guess science does not point you to the existence of God, but to me it does.
If you'd like to see some of the science that points me to Him, you can refer to the following link. http://www.everystudent.com/features/isthere.html
Faith, if it wasn't for that, I'd say I've been one too many times lucky in my lifetime. Entering my home only to find robbers, getting into car accidents...since I do not believe in luck, I am convicted that it was God protecting me in these situations. So yes, my belief in the existence of God is based on my faith in Him and the universe that I believe He created also points to Him.
As for whom I believe is God, God is Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ is love and love is Him. I believe before all things He was, He is and He will continue to be. He has no beginning, no end. He created all things, and without Him nothing was created. This is my faith, to be quite frank my faith not only brings me peace of mind, but it helps me sleep at night without wondering what's going to happen in the end of time. If your angle brings you comfort as well, then that's good for you.
Thanks AncientGlory, I do appreciate your respectful and uncalculating responses.
Have a good one.
Don't know if you found that video or if it is in your interest to know why others believe in God, but here's the link...
http://www.elakiri.com/forum/showthread.php?t=155845&page=8
I would think that you are well comfortable in your stance.
Have a good one!
http://www.elakiri.com/forum/showthread.php?t=155845&page=8
I would think that you are well comfortable in your stance.
Have a good one!
it shows clearly that god exist.the one who suffers will have a good life in his next.and the well being have a responsibility to look after the needy.the poor one should live in patient.
but a person who believe in god knows that he will get the good result for his good action and punishment for his bad deeds.
god doesnt have to come but he sent messengers for us time to time.so to proove god is the only thing u can do is to check with the scriptures.
why u think that god doent exist...becoz u cant see????????!!!!
when a person is sick maximum a doctor can do is to care and treat the patient well but yet with all the modern medicine the person die...
women are suffering with infertility and there are many women who couldnt got conceive even after an ivf.doctors dont know the reason for these type of things...even after their 100% try they get fail results...why...
doesnt this show that there is one above us who decide everything???
women are suffering with infertility and there are many women who couldnt got conceive even after an ivf.doctors dont know the reason for these type of things...even after their 100% try they get fail results...why...
doesnt this show that there is one above us who decide everything???
if u think that there is no god..can u tell me the reason why these things happening !!!
what is the reason for the people whon are suffering????????
is it the nature being unfair to human????????
We cal it karma. and you, your self decide it...
BDW Why dont you say that i dont have a backbone and i'm so weak.. i'm so afraid.. oh man... or something like that. This looks more like that
IF god created the world why did he create those kind of things!!! Why did he didn't create only GOOD in the world????
i think u have to reply me first.....
anyway god didnt create evil but man created it.god is guiding human toward good.
yes brother ur sooooooooooooooooo weak....and to show some thing wrong or right first be genuine to urself.i requested u to post all the 4 verses not one which misunderstand the right meaning.We cal it karma. and you, your self decide it...
BDW Why dont you say that i dont have a backbone and i'm so weak.. i'm so afraid.. oh man... or something like that. This looks more like that
evil or good god has given us permission and free will to decide.he just guiding us...thats it.
I think you know what means Karma
So god is here coz evil is in here!!! who created Evil??? =MAN
So who created GOD???? Answer is simple if you can understand!!!!
Ha ha... ho.. hu.. he...
This shows that God didnt create everything.. You are the first muslim to say that. Even siraj did not make that mistake.. Now we know that god is not almighty and he did not create everything..
Ha ha... ho.. hu.. he...
This shows that God didnt create everything.. You are the first muslim to say that. Even siraj did not make that mistake.. Now we know that god is not almighty and he did not create everything..
I think you know what means Karma
So god is here coz evil is in here!!! who created Evil??? =MAN
So who created GOD???? Answer is simple if you can understand!!!!
no its wrong.....god created human with a free will unlike the animals or trees.he gave us an ability to think and decide what is good and bad.so the oerson who is a good human will get reward in a next life.this is a test for next life.what we seed here get the reward in next life.if man is good there wont be evil in this world.
i know what is karma but i dont believe about a rebirth.god is testing with difficulties not becoz of sin he did in past...but its a test for the person and parents and family.the more we suffer in this life we get more reward in our next life.
Well thank you for your time and effort. It is clear to me how you know GOD is there. Thanks again.
Thank you for the link, it is interesting, It starts with the "Watch Maker" analogy and give many more examples about the complexity of universe and try to prove GODs existance with the "Watch Maker" analogy.
Simply the whole idea is this. Something so complex cannot come in to existence just like that, there need to be a creator, Just like a watch has a watch maker.
There are so many faults in this assumption, I'm not gonna talk about them. But I cannot call this assumption science. This is no way scientific proof. This is just another assumption. You see when assumptions become science, they are usually proven. God assumption is not proven by science. There's no scientific proof for GOD to the best of my knowledge.
Thanks and I too appreciate your responding.
Don't know if you found that video or if it is in your interest to know why others believe in God, but here's the link...
http://www.elakiri.com/forum/showthread.php?t=155845&page=8
I would think that you are well comfortable in your stance.
Have a good one!
Thanks.
Are you sure? Even If I don't believe in GOD and if I suffer through all my life, I still get a good life in my next??
I think we can say a person who believe in GOD "assumes"... but he can never "KNOW". The original question in the thread was, how do you KNOW? So far no answers, that will prove beyond doubt that GOD exists.
If you believe something, there is no certainty associated with it. So you can never know, but only assume that he exists.
No offense, but this is the most ridiculous and illogical argument I was given as a proof of GOD. How a book will prove the existence of GOD is beyond me.
Yes.
