What is Buddhism ?

kosandpol

Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    NOTE : This is in the PRO section. No silly one liners, nonsense posts or smilies allowed here.

    What exactly is Buddhism ?
    Not discussing about the history, legends, fables or culture here.

    What is considered to be the true Buddhism ?
    Is it segregated according to sex ? if so, how and what ?
    Is it segregated according to state of the person (ordained / not ordained) ? if so, how ?

    If possible, please try to keep the discussion in English.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: IKL and tharindu455
    Aug 19, 2008
    11,653
    167
    0
    Sri Lanka
    Thanks.
    In short Buddha's teaching
    is the way out of Suffering.
    It is as simple as that.

    In a bit of detail
    Suffering,
    the cause of suffering
    eradication of suffering
    and way out of suffering,

     
    Last edited:
    • Like
    Reactions: Vishwalisha

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    AtulaSiriwardane said:
    Thanks.
    In short Buddha's teaching
    is the way out of Suffering.
    It is as simple as that.
    Not good enough. Explain more.
    What is defined as "suffering" in Buddhism ?
     

    madurax86

    Member
    Jun 29, 2006
    4,385
    88
    0
    Suffering: As defined in Buddhism, it is what makes you live. Living is a suffering you'll have happy times and bad times. No one has only happy times. Suffering is because of "loba","dhosha","moha" if you detach from these you'll get at least for a minute the real happiness. Its not happy either its an idle state of mind. To end suffering you have to end life(birth) to do that all these attachments should be detached

    Buddhism doesn't end suffering for you. You should do that. And Buddhism is not a "strict" policy anyone can take what they like and practice separately if they wish but they'll soon acknowledge that a good knowledge of buddhism is needed to end suffering. You cant end it just like that, it takes lifetimes.

    Buddhism is NOT only for the people who want to end suffering, there are such people who knows to keep suffering at a low..those people can practice whats in buddhism to make their lives even better, for those who bump from one problem to another buddhism is MORE helpful. The path to Nirvana is a hard and long one everyone can go but it takes courage and devotion, but for laymen life buddhism has the right tools to assure you a peaceful life if you get on the right path and keep practicing, the chance will be there to attain Nirvana.
    Attaining Nirvana has number of ways of doing so not everyone is needed to goto the level of a Buddha.
     
    Last edited:

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    madurax86, Can you post an answer the opening post as well ? Starting from "What is Buddhism" ?
     

    madurax86

    Member
    Jun 29, 2006
    4,385
    88
    0
    For the question what is buddhism
    Most of the definitions say its the path to enlightenment, sure it is. But then why does ordinary laymen -who are going or not going attain nirvana in few thousand years- practice it?
    The answer is simple Buddhism has used the human mind to witness the most advanced things that even we have thought not understandable. Buddha's brain was not more complex than an ordinary human's. It was the same. But the mind was at a higher state. Its the ultimate use of human hardware for something good. It has lessons for using human intelligence in the right way. And it has the ultimate truth, unfortunately buddhism too got fragmented to schools and theravada is considered most pure but it too has been under Hindu influence.
     
    • Like
    Reactions: twisted

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    madurax86 said:
    For the question what is buddhism
    Most of the definitions say its the path to enlightenment, sure it is. But then why does ordinary laymen -who are going or not going attain nirvana in few thousand years- practice it?
    The answer is simple Buddhism has used the human mind to witness the most advanced things that even we have thought not understandable. Buddha's brain was not more complex than an ordinary human's. It was the same. But the mind was at a higher state. Its the ultimate use of human hardware for something good. It has lessons for using human intelligence in the right way. And it has the ultimate truth, unfortunately buddhism too got fragmented to schools and theravada is considered most pure but it too has been under Hindu influence.
    ok, so what exactly is Buddhism ? If even theravada is influenced by hinduism (isnt that a bit a of a paradox ? theravada meaning "what the Buddha said" ? ) is there no pure Buddhism left anywhere ? even on scriptures ?
     

    madurax86

    Member
    Jun 29, 2006
    4,385
    88
    0
    kosandpol said:
    ok, so what exactly is Buddhism ? If even theravada is influenced by hinduism (isnt that a bit a of a paradox ? theravada meaning "what the Buddha said" ? ) is there no pure Buddhism left anywhere ? even on scriptures ?

    Buddhism is a suggested way of life, that can lead you to Nirvana. Its an answer to the question, "Why are we here, cant we end this?"

    Theravada has the most of what Buddha said, I think the tipitaka written in alu vihare, sri lanka is the most pure. Buddhism mainly spread thru lectures face to face. And some people had to be taught in ways that are very dependent on the learner. Actually the teacher adjusted what he teaches according to the student. That can only be done by someone who has attained some stage like "sowan",'sakrudagami"..etc
    Now if you are going to learn real buddhism you;ll have to think for yourself about facts that they deliver. Buddhism is based on understanding and reasoning so no statement can make another statement in buddhism false. This can be applied to most cases, there are monks who have attained higher states but those states are not very significant compared to monks of buddhism 2000 years ago. But for us laymens their knowledge is enough. The "meat" problem is a confusion that was aroused by some monks, they stress that they under go a vegetarian diet because they are "buddhist"
    thats where they went wrong, buddha said, eat what you get if it's eatable and do not ASK
     
    Last edited:

    akolla

    Active member
  • May 29, 2007
    1,496
    4
    38
    AtulaSiriwardane said:
    Thanks.
    In short Buddha's teaching
    is the way out of Suffering.
    It is as simple as that.

    In a bit of detail
    Suffering,
    the cause of suffering
    eradication of suffering
    and way out of suffering,



    simple, clear and well on the topic by athula to start up with............
    a request/suggestion to konsodpol.... if you can more simplify those questions or if you can start up yourself by adding something to those questions more people will join the discussion and that would kick off the topic....... for most of us we would find it hard to answer it straight cuz of our relatively low knowledge of it and on the other hand all will be benifited regardless of their level of knowledge of budhism if you can make it more simple ............
     

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    madurax86 said:
    Buddhism is a suggested way of life, that can lead you to Nirvana.
    So the end goal of Buddhism is to reach Nirvana. Which raises the question what is Nirvana ?

    Theravada has the most of what Buddha said, I think the tipitaka written in alu vihare, sri lanka is the most pure. Buddhism mainly spread thru lectures face to face. And some people had to be taught in ways that are very dependent on the learner. Actually the teacher adjusted what he teaches according to the student. That can only be done by someone who has attained some stage like "sowan",'sakrudagami"..etc
    The thripitaka itself has 3 sections right ? Suthra Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the theology, Vinaya Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the rules and regulations for the ordained, and I forgot the 3rd.

    Now obviously the Suthra pitakaya is what The Lord Buddha taught. Since that is where the theology is explained. Is it correct then to say that this is the true Buddhism ?

    Also this raises a second less important question, does the other 2 sections contain only the words of the Buddha or do they contain teachings of other prominent Arahaths or other learned persons as well ?

    Now if you are going to learn real buddhism you;ll have to think for yourself about facts that they deliver. Buddhism is based on understanding and reasoning so no statement can make another statement in buddhism false.
    This is an interesting concept.
    The "meat" problem is a confusion that was aroused by some monks, they stress that they under go a vegetarian diet because they are "buddhist"
    thats where they went wrong, buddha said, eat what you get if it's eatable and do not ASK
    Ok, so what you say is that by stressing to be vegetarians, they are creating a certain amount of "klesha" ?
     
    Aug 19, 2008
    11,653
    167
    0
    Sri Lanka
    madurax86 said:
    Suffering: As defined in Buddhism, it is what makes you live.

    True.
    Dukkhehi pathitthitho loko.
    Existence is established on suffering.
    Buddha says.

    Living is a suffering you'll have happy times and bad times. No one has only happy times.
    The happiness also based on suffering.
    Too much of happiness can kill someone.
    We enjoy cold when it is hot
    that happiness is relative to heat.
    When cold is too much we realize that we are suffering.
    Within a range of suffering we enjoy
    in relation to something else.
    If we have live upeksha (with awareness)
    we don't suffer.

    Suffering is because of "loba","dhosha","moha" if you detach from these you'll get at least for a minute the real happiness.

    Some try this with Hindu meditation techniques,
    Laukika Samadhi,
    not knowing that they are in a state of Moha.
    The way out of suffering is
    being aware of suffering with upeksha.
    You can ignore Raga and dwesha
    by focusing on another object.
    You will enjoy peace.
    But you are in a state of moha'
    which makes you are not suitable for daily life.
    You will have to isolate yourself.
    The difference of Buddha's Vipassana
    is that
    Vipassana makes you aware of your self more and more
    with increasing Upeksha.
    So with Vipassana
    one is aware of
    Raga, Dwesha and Moha Sanskara
    within oneself
    but have upeksha.

    Vaya Dhamma Sankhara,
    uppada vaya dhammino.

    Decay is the quality of Sanskhara.
    If it arises it passes.

    Uppajjhitwa nirujjhanthi,

    (if one allows)
    what was arisen passes away.

    With Vipassana we practice that.


    Its not happy either its an idle state of mind. To end suffering you have to end life(birth) to do that all these attachments should be detached

    You know what more than many,
    but don't know how.
    Perhaps you may be in Pachcheka Buddha lineage.


    Buddhism doesn't end suffering for you. You should do that. And Buddhism is not a "strict" policy anyone can take what they like and practice separately if they wish but they'll soon acknowledge that a good knowledge of buddhism is needed to end suffering. You cant end it just like that, it takes lifetimes.

    His teaching has the quality of Akalika.
    It is instant.
    He teaches the way out of suffering.
    With every step on the way
    suffering decreases,
    if you are on the right path.

    I practiced other techniques before Vipassana.
    My suffering increased till I find Vipassana,
    and decreased after.
    My awareness improved, equanimity developed.
    So I know that I am on the right path.

    Buddhism is NOT only for the people who want to end suffering, there are such people who knows to keep suffering at a low..those people can practice whats in buddhism to make their lives even better, for those who bump from one problem to another buddhism is MORE helpful.
    True.
    But for people who live according to his teaching
    overall suffering becomes less.
    But one can fail if he developed only Seela and Samadhi.
    But the amount of Pragna one attained
    will never be lost.

    The path to Nirvana is a hard and long one everyone can go but it takes courage and devotion, but for laymen life buddhism has the right tools to assure you a peaceful life if you get on the right path and keep practicing, the chance will be there to attain Nirvana.

    100% true.
    It is not by chance though.

    Attaining Nirvana has number of ways of doing so not everyone is needed to goto the level of a Buddha.

    Namely 3 ways

    Shrawaka Buddha
    One who learns Vipassana
    from some one else,
    get enlightened,
    and MAY teach some others.

    Pachcheka Buddha
    One who discovers Vipassana
    by oneself
    and do not teach others.

    Samma Sambuddha
    One who discovers Vipassana
    by oneself
    and finds Vipassana
    to teach
    any other
    who has capacity.

    -What path would you choose, if you can choose?-
     

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    akolla said:
    simple, clear and well on the topic by athula to start up with............
    a request/suggestion to konsodpol.... if you can more simplify those questions or if you can start up yourself by adding something to those questions more people will join the discussion and that would kick off the topic....... for most of us we would find it hard to answer it straight cuz of our relatively low knowledge of it and on the other hand all will be benifited regardless of their level of knowledge of budhism if you can make it more simple ............
    Simplify the questions... I'm not sure If I know how to simplify the questions even further..
    Can you give it a try ?
    My questions were :
    What exactly is Buddhism ?
    What is considered to be the true Buddhism ?
    Is it segregated according to sex ? if so, how and what ?
    Is it segregated according to state of the person (ordained / not ordained) ? if so, how ?
     

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    AtulaSiriwardane said:
    True.
    Dukkhehi pathitthitho loko.
    Existence is established on suffering.
    Buddha says.

    so it comes to, Existence is suffering. Then does killing ones self end the suffering ? under the pretext that, if you're dead, you wont exist ?

    The happiness also based on suffering.
    Too much of happiness can kill someone.
    We enjoy cold when it is hot
    that happiness is relative to heat.
    When cold is too much we realize that we are suffering.
    Within a range of suffering we enjoy
    in relation to something else.
    If we have live upeksha (with awareness)
    we don't suffer.
    So happiness is always relative to the surrounding environment ?
    Then the same can be said to unhappiness isnt it ?
    Is this what Upeksha teaches ? that the state you're in is always relative and its not finite ?

    Some try this with Hindu meditation techniques,
    Laukika Samadhi,
    not knowing that they are in a state of Moha.
    The way out of suffering is
    being aware of suffering with upeksha.
    You can ignore Raga and dwesha
    by focusing on another object.
    You will enjoy peace.
    But you are in a state of moha'
    which makes you are not suitable for daily life.

    Can you explain this ?
    Moha means not knowing right ? but Upeksha means knowing. So How can one be in both states at the same time ?
    Also this level of understanding is not enough daily life ? how ? why ?

    His teaching has the quality of Akalika.
    It is instant.
    [/quote]
    but Akalika means timeless isnt it ? not instant.


    But for people who live according to his teaching
    overall suffering becomes less.
    But one can fail if he developed only Seela and Samadhi.
    But the amount of Pragna one attained
    will never be lost.
    But can one develop only Seela and Samadhi without Pragna ?

    Namely 3 ways

    These are the 3 type of Buddhas. To attain Nirvana, one doesnt have to be a Buddha right ? By reaching the state of Arahath, you will attained Nirvana at your death wont you ?​
     
    Aug 19, 2008
    11,653
    167
    0
    Sri Lanka
    kosandpol said:
    So the end goal of Buddhism is to reach Nirvana. Which raises the question what is Nirvana ?
    The literal meaning is
    No Attachment.
    If you can be fully aware of yourself
    and equanimous,
    you are not attached.
    But it is not permanent.
    As long as one has Klesha inside
    one can't experience Nirvana in its real form.


    The thripitaka itself has 3 sections right ? Suthra Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the theology, Vinaya Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the rules and regulations for the ordained, and I forgot the 3rd.
    Abhidhamma.
    The higher principles of nature.

    Now obviously the Suthra pitakaya is what The Lord Buddha taught. Since that is where the theology is explained. Is it correct then to say that this is the true Buddhism ?
    According to my knowledge and practice
    4 Noble truths,
    Patichcha Samuppada
    and
    Sathipatthana Sutta
    are the core.
    The rest is not necessary for an actual seeker.
     

    madurax86

    Member
    Jun 29, 2006
    4,385
    88
    0
    kosandpol said:
    So the end goal of Buddhism is to reach Nirvana. Which raises the question what is Nirvana ?


    The thripitaka itself has 3 sections right ? Suthra Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the theology, Vinaya Pitakaya, which is supposed to have the rules and regulations for the ordained, and I forgot the 3rd.

    Now obviously the Suthra pitakaya is what The Lord Buddha taught. Since that is where the theology is explained. Is it correct then to say that this is the true Buddhism ?

    Also this raises a second less important question, does the other 2 sections contain only the words of the Buddha or do they contain teachings of other prominent Arahaths or other learned persons as well ?
    I do think so, suthras are from buddha and some other tips might be from other Arahath monks who have gone to good stages of mind. Theres no problem in them putting facts in to the scriptures because they are too enlightened or near to it than others so its good advice

    This is an interesting concept.
    yeah

    Ok, so what you say is that by stressing to be vegetarians, they are creating a certain amount of "klesha" ?

    May be they are, they are not flowing what intelligence leads to or buddhism says to. Vegetarianism is also a concept, trees too live. Its the circle of life, one born must die doesnt matter for what. If its for meat the corpse fills a stomach. If it just dies it never does that! But killing is a sin, we all want to live we thrive for it. Everyone. But nature has its own ways, it has to control populations ..etc for monks they should accept what is given to them meat or veges, because the animal wasnt killed for the monk, if so there is a sin. But most of the monks in SL ask for fish, meat ...etc that worsens the situation!
     

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    madurax86 said:
    I do think so, suthras are from buddha and some other tips might be from other Arahath monks who have gone to good stages of mind. Theres no problem in them putting facts in to the scriptures because they are too enlightened or near to it than others so its good advice
    Doesnt the state of Arahath means that they are enlightened ?

    May be they are, they are not flowing what intelligence leads to or buddhism says to. Vegetarianism is also a concept, trees too live. Its the circle of life, one born must die doesnt matter for what. If its for meat the corpse fills a stomach. If it just dies it never does that! But killing is a sin, we all want to live we thrive for it. Everyone. But nature has its own ways, it has to control populations ..etc for monks they should accept what is given to them meat or veges, because the animal wasnt killed for the monk, if so there is a sin. But most of the monks in SL ask for fish, meat ...etc that worsens the situation!
    So what's missing here is the understanding that food is only for sustenance and that one must not develop a liking ("Asha") for it.
    When there's no liking for it and that you have the understanding that the food is consumed only to keep your body alive and healthy, what you eat is no longer a problem.
    Is that right ?

    BTW, lets not divert too much in to what monks today do or dont.
     

    amila_90210

    Member
    Jul 5, 2008
    17,444
    436
    0
    ෴පද පේළී෴
    kosandpol said:
    If possible, please try to keep the discussion in English.

    this is the hard part..i would love to express my self in sinhala..cos i learned Buddhism in sinhala...Its very hard to me.to express what i know in English.& dont wanna spoil the thread..But i d be keep ma eye on the topic... thanks
     

    kosandpol

    Well-known member
  • Jun 10, 2008
    45,329
    1,492
    113
    amila_90210 said:

    this is the hard part..i would love to express my self in sinhala..cos i learned Buddhism in sinhala...Its very hard to me.to express what i know in English.& dont wanna spoil the thread..But i d be keep ma eye on the topic... thanks
    no, its ok. Join in Sinhala.
    I only asked to keep it in English if possible. Not a must.
    English is easier for me to read. That's why I asked that.
     

    tharinda07

    Member
    Mar 1, 2007
    5,784
    44
    0
    amila_90210 said:

    this is the hard part..i would love to express my self in sinhala..cos i learned Buddhism in sinhala...Its very hard to me.to express what i know in English.& dont wanna spoil the thread..But i d be keep ma eye on the topic... thanks
    me too