Onboard audio Vs Decated sound card

[Dj.BigBear]

so what happens to the DAC's in the receiver...
you are telling about that valve amps...
name me a one that hasn't a SPDIF input..?
other than a valve amp..

DAC - Receiver - AMP

those 3 things are not the same.....

while some Receiver already has built in Amplifiers, most Amplifier is not a Receiver.

please do not mention the word Amps to describe a Receiver.... it's a Receiver....

Receiver - a device to decode digital (coax/optical) data
Amplifiers - a device which amplifies analog signals

FYI, most Audiophile don't use Receiver.... (audiophiles only listens to audiophile grade music)
we just connect CD Player - (DAC) - Amplifiers - (Equalizer) - Speakers/Headphones

usually a Receiver is used for HT / HTPC setup.... what is HT / HTPC? Home Theater/ Home Theater PC

 

[samiram]

resampling or not.... i;ve explained about digital data passing through onboard and offboard soundcard......
still the quality differs even if it's just passing through.

and, no not all indonesian can afford decent setup.... most of use ask about which setup is best suited for them price/performance, and they're quite open to suggestions.
that's why sometime we indonesian can utilize cheap setup to produce greater audio quality..... coz we do lotsa asking and experimenting.... mix & match.

it's not about nationality..... it's about the character of each person.... are you willing to accept the facts?
becoz this matter is not something debateable.... why? coz some experts already did decades ago, and proven worldwide.

thats a doubt...
after long time i log on to my fv..
audio site AVforums...
now im reading some threads..
now they suggest the best way to link is HDMI..
SPDIF is now overloaded by HDDVD sounds..
but nothing about RCA setups(except this)...

Well, technically speaking both optical and coaxial connection is SPDIF... An optical connection is SPDIF via a Toslink connector, coaxial connection via RCA or BNC is just SPDIF via an electrical connection. But if it helps understanding the table, sure.

ref - http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=657850&highlight=spdif+vs+rca

 

[samiram]

DAC - Receiver - AMP

those 3 things are not the same.....

while some Receiver already has built in Amplifiers, most Amplifier is not a Receiver.

please do not mention the word Amps to describe a Receiver.... it's a Receiver....

Receiver - a device to decode digital (coax/optical) data
Amplifiers - a device which amplifies analog signals

FYI, most Audiophile don't use Receiver.... (audiophiles only listens to audiophile grade music)
we just connect CD Player - (DAC) - Amplifiers - (Equalizer) - Speakers/Headphones

usually a Receiver is used for HT / HTPC setup.... what is HT / HTPC? Home Theater/ Home Theater PC

ok..
my bad..
so whats the connection between CD player and the DAC's...?

 

[Dj.BigBear]

thats a doubt...
after long time i log on to my fv..
audio site AVforums...
now im reading some threads..
now they suggest the best way to link is HDMI..
SPDIF is now overloaded by HDDVD sounds..
but nothing about RCA setups(except this)...



ref - http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=657850&highlight=spdif+vs+rca

it's for Movies laddie........ for HT setup.... not audiophile setup.
but even using HDMI still won't beat hi-end Analog RCA connections
if you have a decent soundcard to test it... you could hear it for yourself by testing out digital(optical/coax) - HDMI - Analog
while HDMI has bigger bandwith than the rest.... it simply lacks the support for sound processing as of now.

like it or not.... even if you use digital/spdif/HDMI.... it still needs to be converted to analog signal by Receivers.....
by doing that, your Receiver will rely on digital data feeds coming from the soundcard..... then it all goes back to square one.... does the soundcard provide decent digital feeds with less jitter and error?

ok..
my bad..
so whats the connection between CD player and the DAC's...?

CD Player has DAC in it.... which converts digital data(CD) to analog signal(sound pulse) to be later converted into sounds by an amp/receiver then speakers.

 

[samiram]

it's for Movies laddie........ for HT setup.... not audiophile setup.
but even using HDMI still won't beat hi-end Analog RCA connections




CD Player has DAC in it.... which converts digital data(CD) to analog signal(sound pulse) to be later converted into sounds by an amp/receiver then speakers.

hmm...
really interesting..
all this arguments for this..
thats PCM you **** ***.. (im really angry..)
PCM - Pulse-code modulation - digital representation of an analog signal... ref - http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid7_gci214284,00.html
so ultimately its a digital connection..
you need some learning about electronics dude...
BTW i saw the specs of some high end DAC's..
they all have an SPDIF in..
eg- Apogee MiniDac, Benchmark DAC1....
this argument is over...
RCA(aka S/PDIF coaxial on RCA)
is the best...

 

[Dj.BigBear]

hmm...
really interesting..
all this arguments for this..
thats PCM you **** ***.. (im really angry..)
PCM - Pulse-code modulation - digital representation of an analog signal... ref - http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/sDefinition/0,,sid7_gci214284,00.html
so ultimately its a digital connection..
you need some learning about electronics dude...
BTW i saw the specs of some high end DAC's..
they all have an SPDIF in..
eg- Apogee MiniDac, Benchmark DAC1....
this argument is over...
RCA(aka S/PDIF coaxial on RCA)
is the best...

audio is not always about numbers and electricity.... that you need to know laddie.
what you need is not the definition.... but "how to use it" explanation.
as of now... i still haven't heard an HDMI setup that can beat old digital setup(HDMI is still too premature, and needs forther developing), and i still haven't heard a hi-end digital setup that can beat a hi-end Analog RCA setup in audiophiles.....

and please remember... it's a DAC.... it has SPDIF "IN"..... just to receive digital data to be converted into analog signal AGAIN by the DAC.... (remember that DAC is the same as soundcard)

please do some more research on the net.

remember that each usage has different setup.
example... for hi-end Movies is never the same as for hi-end Music.

 

[samiram]

it's for Movies laddie........ for HT setup.... not audiophile setup.
but even using HDMI still won't beat hi-end Analog RCA connections
if you have a decent soundcard to test it... you could hear it for yourself by testing out digital(optical/coax) - HDMI - Analog
while HDMI has bigger bandwith than the rest.... it simply lacks the support for sound processing as of now.

like it or not.... even if you use digital/spdif/HDMI.... it still needs to be converted to analog signal by Receivers.....
by doing that, your Receiver will rely on digital data feeds coming from the soundcard..... then it all goes back to square one.... does the soundcard provide decent digital feeds with less jitter and error?



CD Player has DAC in it.... which converts digital data(CD) to analog signal(sound pulse) to be later converted into sounds by an amp/receiver then speakers.

yeas you have to..
because speakers wont run by didigtal signals..
even the best DAC's cant convert the signal without a lost..(its simple science..)
and read more about jitter..
its not what you are thinking..

 

[samiram]

audio is not always about numbers and electricity.... that you need to know laddie.

and please remember... it's a DAC.... it has SPDIF "IN"..... just to receive digital data to be converted into analog signal AGAIN by the DAC.... (remember that DAC is the same as soundcard)

please do some more research on the net.

remember that each usage has different setup.
example... for hi-end Movies is never the same as for hi-end Music.

no no now you are getting away from the topic..
its about the connection between a pc and a amp..
so you cant have good audiophile level DAC's in sound cards..(if so give me a model..)
so if you need a audiophile level quality you need a good amp(including DAC's)....
and a digital connection from the PC..
is that what we were arguing for..?

 

[Dj.BigBear]

yeas you have to..
because speakers wont run by didigtal signals..
even the best DAC's cant convert the signal without a lost..(its simple science..)
and read more about jitter..
its not what you are thinking..

do not confuse usual data jitter with audio jitter... it's not the same....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jitter

 

[samiram]

audio is not always about numbers and electricity.... that you need to know laddie.
what you need is not the definition.... but "how to use it" explanation.
as of now... i still haven't heard an HDMI setup that can beat old digital setup(HDMI is still too premature, and needs forther developing), and i still haven't heard a hi-end digital setup that can beat a hi-end Analog RCA setup in audiophiles.....

and please remember... it's a DAC.... it has SPDIF "IN"..... just to receive digital data to be converted into analog signal AGAIN by the DAC.... (remember that DAC is the same as soundcard)

please do some more research on the net.

remember that each usage has different setup.
example... for hi-end Movies is never the same as for hi-end Music.

BTW i did my research..
and i refer the researched links..
any doubts in that..?

 

[Dj.BigBear]

no no now you are getting away from the topic..
its about the connection between a pc and a amp..
so you cant have good audiophile level DAC's in sound cards..(if so give me a model..)
so if you need a audiophile level quality you need a good amp(including DAC's)....
and a digital connection from the PC..
is that what we were arguing for..?

i keep saying to you over and over again......
i was the first one that says NO PC SOUNDCARDS/DAC is audiophile grade.... only near-audiophile grade!

that's as close as it gets with a PC audiophile setup.

and NO

even to acquire that near audiophile grade.... you can't use digital... why? becoz the sound comes out from digital is hollow and stiff... unlike analog which sounds more natural and neutral.

and clearly offboard soundcard is the better one at doing that job.
actually even in digital pass through, offboard soundcard still gets the job done better than onboard.

 

[Dj.BigBear]

BTW i did my research..
and i refer the researched links..
any doubts in that..?

you need to do research from basic... you're looking in the wrong place....

try http://www.head-fi.org/forums/

try bashing your head in..... see what will the other seniors (who knows more than i do) respond to your questions/statements.

 

[samiram]

i keep saying to you over and over again......
i was the first one that says NO PC SOUNDCARDS/DAC is audiophile grade.... only near-audiophile grade!

that's as close as it gets with a PC audiophile setup.

and NO

even to acquire that near audiophile grade.... you can't use digital... why? becoz the sound comes out from digital is hollow and stiff... unlike analog which sounds more natural and neutral.

and clearly offboard soundcard is the better one at doing that job.
actually even in digital pass through, offboard soundcard still gets the job done better than onboard.

so what you sujjest to connect..
a audiophile level CD player and a high end external DAC....

 

[samiram]

you need to do research from basic... you're looking in the wrong place....

try http://www.head-fi.org/forums/

try bashing your head in..... see what will the other seniors (who knows more than i do) respond to your questions/statements.

ok give me a link.
that has details about the best connections from..
a CD player to a external DAC....

 

[Dj.BigBear]

so what you sujjest to connect..
a audiophile level CD player and a high end external DAC....

actually even to get those near-audiophile from PC is not an easy and cheap task.
and most certainly will amaze you so... that my friend, i can guarantee you.

you can only appreciate audiophile grade sound one step at a time....

but basically yes....
if you want pure audiophile setup.... you will need
audiophile CD Player - decent high end/DIY DAC* - decent amplifiers - decent equalizer* - decent speakers.

* = optional

 

[Dj.BigBear]

ok give me a link.
that has details about the best connections from..
a CD player to a external DAC....

click the link i've supplied on earlier post
and find it for yourself..... it's a research.... but reading some of random threads on that forum will give you the big picture.
register and post a new thread asking about it if you must.

that's as far as i can help you with.

 

[samiram]

actually even to get those near-audiophile from PC is not an easy and cheap task.
and most certainly will amaze you so... that my friend, i can guarantee you.

you can only appreciate audiophile grade sound one step at a time....

but basically yes....
if you want pure audiophile setup.... you will need
audiophile CD Player - decent high end/DIY DAC* - decent amplifiers - decent equalizer* - decent speakers.

* = optional

i ask the connection method..
how you'll connect the CD Player with the decent high end/DIY DAC or the decent amplifiers....

 

[samiram]

click the link i've supplied on earlier post
and find it for yourself..... it's a research.... but reading some of random threads on that forum will give you the big picture.
register and post a new thread asking about it if you must.

that's as far as i can help you with.

yup i will do it.
its searching feature is little bitt annoying..
with all the image verifications..
that why i ask for a direct link..

 

[samiram]

click the link i've supplied on earlier post
and find it for yourself..... it's a research.... but reading some of random threads on that forum will give you the big picture.
register and post a new thread asking about it if you must.

that's as far as i can help you with.

BTW i found that..
best analogue connector for professionals..
is XLR's...
RCA's are mostly uses for connecting analogue audio sources(cassette player, Phono player )..
to a power amp..
and also uses to carry SPDIF-formatted digital audio to DAC's..
see your self...
eg - http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f21/can-i-use-1-4-ts-rca-adaptor-trs-plug-285679/

 

[samiram]

Dj.BigBear...????????
where are you..?